[Houston Archaeological and Historical Commission on February 15, 2024.]
[00:00:14]
IT'S, UH, THURSDAY FE FEBRUARY 15TH, 2024.
TODAY'S MEETING OF THE HOUSTON ARCHEOLOGICAL AND CIRCLE COMMISSION.
I'M COMMISSION CHAIR DAVID EK TO VERIFY WE HAVE A QUORUM.
THE CHAIR IS PRESIDENT, UH, IS PRESENT.
COMMISSIONER COSGROVE? PRESENT.
PRESENT AND PLANNING DIRECTOR JENNIFER OSLAND.
WE HAVE A QUORUM AND WE WILL, UM, I DON'T SEE, UH, MARTA CORNELL HERE, SO WE'LL, WE'LL PROCEED WITH THE DIRECTOR'S REPORT.
UM, GOOD AFTERNOON, MR. CHAIR AND COMMISSIONERS.
I'M INTER DIRECT INTERIM DIRECTOR OF THE PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT.
UH, AS MANY OF YOU KNOW, AS EVERYBODY KNOWS, UM, AT LEAST AROUND THE TABLE HERE, WE, UH, WISHED MARGARET WALLACE BROWN, UM, DIRECTOR OF THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT, ALL THE BEST ON HER RETIREMENT LAST FRIDAY, FEBRUARY 9TH.
UM, SHE CERTAINLY LEFT THE LEGACY WITH THE CITY AND WORKED SUPER HARD ON THIS, UM, COMMISSION AND WITH THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION OFFICE.
UM, SHE WAS WITH THE CITY FOR 37 YEARS, AND SO SHE'S OFF ON A WELL-DESERVED RETIREMENT.
UM, FOR ANYBODY INTERESTED TO KNOW, THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT TURNED 84 YESTERDAY, SO AT LEAST THAT'S WHEN WE, WE CELEBRATED ON THE 14TH, SO IT WAS SOMEWHERE AROUND THERE, BUT THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT WAS ESTABLISHED BY CITY COUNCIL WAY BACK WHEN, SO WE ALWAYS HAVE FUN WITH THAT.
UM, SAVE THE DATE FOR, UH, SATURDAY, MARCH 23RD FOR THE HIS, UH, TRAINING, AND THAT'S FOR HHC COMMISSIONERS AND THE HPAB BOARD MEMBERS.
AND I'M, I'M SURE TAYLOR HAS ALREADY SENT OUT SOMETHING, UM, FOR THAT.
BUT WE ARE WORKING WITH THE, UM, CAMP ORGANIZATION ON GETTING THE RIGHT PEOPLE, UH, THE TRAINERS LINED UP AND WE KNOW WE WANT IT TO BE SPECIFIC TO THE WORK Y'ALL DO.
SO, UM, WE APPRECIATE ALL THE FEEDBACK YOU'VE GIVEN US ON THE TOPICS YOU WANT COVERED, AND WE ARE WORKING HARD TO MAKE SURE THAT IT'S RELEVANT, THAT THE MATERIAL IS RELEVANT.
UM, IF ANYONE HAS A, IF ANY COMMISSIONERS HAVE AN EXPIRED BADGE, PLEASE CONTACT ANGELINA PINEDA.
UH, SHE'S NOT HERE TODAY, BUT IT'S ANGELINA DOT PINEDA@HOUSTONTX.GOV.
WE'LL, WE'LL EMAIL YOU THAT SO YOU'LL HAVE IT.
UM, OR YOU CAN CONTACT MARETTE WHO'S SITTING RIGHT THERE AT THE END OF THIS MEETING AND LET HER KNOW, UH, A SNAPSHOT OF SOME WORK THAT'S, UH, NOT ON TODAY'S AGENDA, BUT UH, THAT OUR TEAM HAS BEEN, UM, INVOLVED IN.
UH, WE RECEIVED A TOTAL OF 41 APPLICATIONS SINCE YOUR LAST UPDATE IN JANUARY 14 WERE ADMINISTRATIVE APPROVALS AND THERE WERE EIGHT PRE-DESIGN REVIEW APPLICATIONS.
WE HAVE NO LANDMARK OR PROTECTED LANDMARK ACTIVITY TO REPORT.
AND IF ANYONE HAS ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT ANY OF THESE ITEMS OR SOMETHING ELSE, YOU CAN CALL THE HOUSTON OFFICE OF PRESERVATION HOTLINE AT 8 3 2 3 9 3 6 5 5 6 OR VISIT OUR WEBSITE@HOUSTONPLANNING.COM.
AND THAT CONCLUDES MY DIRECTOR'S REPORT.
WE'RE GONNA PROCEED WITH THE NEXT ITEM WOULD BE ITEM A.
UH, WE FIRST WE HAVE THE CONSIDERATION OF THE HAHC, JANUARY 18TH, 2024 MEETING MINUTES COMMISSION MEMBERS, IF THERE, IF YOU REVIEW THE MINUTES, IF THERE ARE ANY, UH, SUGGESTED CHANGES, PLEASE
[00:05:01]
ANNOUNCE THOSE CHANGES NOW.AND IF THERE ARE NO CHANGES, UH, IS THERE A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE MINUTES? COSGROVE MOVES TO ACCEPT THE MINUTES, WE HAVE A, WE DOWER JACKSON SECONDS.
ARE THERE ANY OPPOSED? ARE THERE ANY ABSTENTIONS? THAT MOTION PASSES AND THEY'RE ACCEPTED.
AND WE'LL NOW MOVE ON TO ITEM A CONSIDERATION OF AND POSSIBLE ACTION ON CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, APPLICATIONS FOR CONSENT AGENDA.
GOOD AFTERNOON, CHAIR, COMMISSIONERS AND THE PUBLIC.
I'M TERRENCE JACKSON AND STAFF RECOMMENDS THE FOLLOWING ITEMS FOR ACTION PER STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS AND ONE MOTION ITEMS A 1 10 40 COURTLAND STREET ALTERATION EDITION, HOUSTON HEIGHTS SOUTH APPROVAL WITH CONDITIONS.
ITEM A 3 3 5 1 6 GARRETT STREET ALTERATION EDITION WESTMORELAND APPROVAL ITEM A 4 5 2 4 EUCLID ALTERATION EDITION IN WOODLAND HEIGHTS.
RECOMMENDATION, APPROVAL ITEM A 6 3 6 1 3 AUTO BOND PLACE ALTERATION WINDOWS AND SIDING.
HISTORIC DISTRICT DENIAL OF A COR WITH CONDITIONS.
ITEM A 7 4 4 9 WEST 19TH STREET, ALTERATION SIGN.
HISTORIC PROTECTED LANDMARK HOUSTON HEIGHTS, WATERWORKS.
RECOMMENDATION, APPROVAL, A 8 1 8 1 9 OXFORD STREET, ALTERATION OF THE AWNING, HOUSTON HEIGHTS EAST.
APPROVAL WITH CONDITIONS, I'M SORRY, APPROVAL.
ITEM A EIGHT IS AN APPROVAL ITEM, A 9 4 2 9 OXFORD STREET, NEW CONSTRUCTION OF GARAGE APARTMENT IN HOUSTON HEIGHTS SOUTH.
RECOMMENDATION, APPROVAL ITEM A 10 12 22 HARVARD STREET ALTERATION EDITION IN HOUSTON HEIGHTS, EAST HISTORIC DISTRICT RECOMMENDATION, APPROVAL ITEM A 11 3 2 0 4 E ENIS STREET, ALTERATION OF RAMP AND STAIRS OF THE HOUSTON LANDMARK, UH, OF THE HOUSTON NEGRO HOSPITAL SCHOOL OF NURSING.
RECOMMENDATION APPROVAL ITEM A 12 3 2 0 4 ENO STREET, ALTERATION OF WINDOWS AND ELEVATOR HOUSTON, UH, HIS HISTORICAL LANDMARK IS, UH, RIVERSIDE HOSPITAL.
RECOMMENDATION, APPROVAL ITEM A 13 5 1 3 BERNARD STREET ALTERATION EDITION IN THE FIRST MONTROSE COMMON HISTORIC DISTRICT APPROVAL WITH CONDITIONS.
ITEM A 14 5 1 3 BERNARD STREET, ALTERATION OF A OF A GARAGE.
RECOMMENDATION, APPROVAL AND ITEM A 15 4 1 8 OMAR STREET ALTERATION ADDITION IN THE WOODLAND HEIGHTS HISTORIC DISTRICT RECOMMENDATION, APPROVAL, THE PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT REQUEST APPROVAL OF ALL STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS FOR THESE PROCEEDING ITEMS, ITEMS PROPOSED FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION.
THEREFORE, THEREFORE ARE ITEMS A TWO AND A FIVE.
COMMISSION MEMBERS, ARE THERE ANY ITEMS ON THE PROPOSED CONSENT AGENDA THAT YOU'D LIKE TO PULL INDIVIDUALLY? COMMISSIONER CURRY? UH, UH, I DON'T KNOW THAT I WANNA PULL ANYTHING, BUT I HAVE A QUESTION FOR, UH, MR. JACKSON, PLEASE PROCEED.
I NOTE THAT ITEMS 11 AND 12 ARE THE SAME ADDRESS.
THEY'RE BOTH FOR APPROVAL GRANTED, BUT THEY'RE DESCRIBED DIFFERENTLY.
IS THAT, IS THAT CORRECT? TO YES, SIR.
THEY WERE, UH, SUBMITTED AS TWO APPLICATIONS, THE MAIN HOSPITAL BUILDING, AND THEN YOU HAVE A NURSING SCHOOL BUILDING WITH AN AUXILIARY BUILDING.
AND THOSE TWO BUILDINGS ARE TOGETHER AND THEY DO FOR THE CITY'S PURPOSES, THEY ARE THE SAME ADDRESS? YES, SIR.
IT'S ON THE SAME LARGER SITE, I BELIEVE.
IF THERE ARE NO OTHER ITEMS TO PULL FROM THE COMMISSION MEMBERS, I WANT TO ASK THE PUBLIC.
I DO HAVE A NUMBER OF PEOPLE SIGNED UP TO SPEAK ON SOME OF THESE ITEMS. UM, MAINLY THEY ARE IN, THEY'RE ALL IN SUPPORT, I BELIEVE.
[00:10:01]
TWO OF THESE ITEMS WITH CONDITIONS.SO, UM, IF YOU HAVE SIGNED UP FOR ONE OF THESE ITEMS ON CONSENT, UM, YOU HAVE, YOU, YOU COULD REQUEST TO HAVE THEM REVIEWED INDIVIDUALLY.
IF NOT, UM, THEY WILL BE APPROVED, UM, IN A BLOCK.
SO PLEASE ANNOUNCE IF YOU WANT TO HAVE SOMETHING INDIVIDUALLY REVIEWED AT THIS TIME.
UM, I HAVE ON THE CONSENT ITEMS, 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, AND 15 COMMISSION MEMBERS.
IS THERE A MOTION TO ACCEPT, UH, STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION FOR THE CONSENT AGENDA AND FOR THE RECOMMENDED, UM, AND FOR THEIR RECOMMENDATIONS AS WELL? DO I HAVE A MOTION? CONSCRIPT MOVES TO ACCEPT STAFF RECOMMENDATION WITH THE, UH, OKAY.
IS THERE A SECOND? WE DOWER JACKSON SECOND.
ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION? A AYE AYE.
IS THERE ANYONE OPPOSED? ARE THERE ANY ABSTENTIONS? THE MOTION PASSES.
AND WE WILL NOW MOVE, I BELIEVE TO ITEM A TWO.
GOOD AFTERNOON, MR. CHAIR AND MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION.
UM, STAFF MEMBER ARSLAN, I SUBMIT FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION.
AGENDA ITEM A TWO AT 14, UH, 12 SOUTH BOULEVARD IN BROADACRE SUBDIVISION.
THE PROPERTY INCLUDES A HISTORIC 5,590 SQUARE FOOT, TWO STORY BRICK SINGLE FAMILY HOUSE WITH A DETACHED, NON-CONTRIBUTING CARRIAGE HOUSE SITUATED ON A 38,295 SQUARE FOOT CORNER LOT.
THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING TO CONSTRUCT A ONE STORY ADDITION.
EXTERIOR ALTERATIONS WERE MADE TO THE HOUSE AROUND 1990 WITH A, WITH A NEW ROOF, NEW DORMERS, AND A WRAPAROUND PORCH ON THE SECOND FLOOR.
THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING TO REMOVE THE ALL OF THE NON-ORIGINAL ALTERATIONS MADE TO THE HOUSE AND TO RESTORE IT TO ITS ORIGINAL ELEVATION AND MASSING TO REMOVE THE EXISTING POOL HOUSE AND PROPOSE TO BUILD A NEW ONE STORY AND TWO STORY ADDITIONS TO THE EXISTING HOUSE STRUCTURE PROPOSES TO BUILD A ONE STORY ADDITION CONNECTED TO THE MAIN HOUSE WITH AN ENCLOSED BREEZEWAY.
ALL OPENINGS MADE AT THE EXISTING STRUCTURE WILL BE PATCHED WITH BRICK THAT WILL BE RESTORED FROM THE EXISTING POOL HOUSE.
THE CLADDING MATERIAL TO BE USED FOR THE NEW ADDITIONS WILL BE SIMILAR.
THE APPLICANT PROPOSES ALSO TO, FOR ALL WINDOWS ON THE EXISTING STRUCTURE TO BE REPLACED WITH NEW ALUMINUM CLAD WINDOWS TO MATCH THE ORIGINAL WOOD WINDOWS AND ALL WINDOWS WILL BE SET IN RECESSED.
THE APPLICANT PROPOSES TO INSTALL DECORATIVE SHUTTERS AS WELL.
STAFF RECOMMENDS PARTIAL APPROVAL FOR REMOVAL OF NON-ORIGINAL WRAPAROUND PORCH.
THE ONE STORY ADDITION, THE REPLACEMENT OF THE FRONT DOOR AND REPLACEMENT OF WINDOWS WITH STAFF APPROVAL DENIAL FOR THE LIBRARY EDITION AND DECORATIVE SHUTTERS.
STAFF RECEIVED A LETTER OF OPPOSITION FROM THE BROAD ACRES ARCHITECTURAL COMMITTEE.
THE ARCHITECT AND OWNER HAVE SIGNED UP TO SPEAK.
YASMINE, UH, COMMISSION MEMBERS.
ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS OF STAFF ON THIS ITEM? OKAY, NOT AT THIS TIME.
SO I DO, UM, I DO HAVE A FEW SPEAKERS SIGNED UP TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM.
UM, SO AT THIS TIME I'M GONNA OPEN UP THE PUBLIC HEARING AND THE FIRST, UH, SPEAKER I HAVE WHO SIGNED UP ON THIS ITEM IS GREG RAFINO.
CAN WE SEE IF HE'S AVAILABLE ON VIRTUALLY OR IS SPEAKERS? PLEASE UNMUTE.
WHEN YOUR NAME IS CALLED MR. RAPINO, WE'RE HAPPY TO HEAR FROM YOU.
STAR SIX UNMUTES YOU FOR MOST, UH, PHONES IF YOU'VE JOINED THAT WAY, OR THE
[00:15:01]
ICON ON THE TOP RIGHT OF YOUR SCREEN IS A WAY TO UNMUTE BY COMPUTER.UM, I DO HAVE ANOTHER SPEAKER SIGN UP.
LET ME ASK IF, IF, UH, IF THE NEXT SPEAKER IS AVAILABLE AND IF MR. FINO DOES EITHER WALK IN THEIR MEETING OR IT STANDS VIRTUALLY, IF YOU'LL LET ME KNOW.
UM, IF YOU SEE HIM, THE NEXT SPEAKER THAT WAS SIGNED UP TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM WAS GEORGE BICKFORD.
SO, UM, NOT HEARING THAT, I GUESS, UM, AS THE PUBLIC HEARING IS STILL OPEN, IS THERE ANY OTHER MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC ATTENDING EITHER IN THE ROOM, IN PERSON OR ATTENDING THIS MEETING VIRTUALLY THAT WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM? UH, IF SO, PLEASE ANNOUNCE YOURSELF AT THIS TIME.
I'M GONNA CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AT THIS TIME AND COMMISSION MEMBERS.
UM, ARE THERE, IS THERE FURTHER DISCUSSION OR QUESTIONS OF STAFF ON THIS ITEM OF THIS HOUSE? IS IT, IS, UM, REVERSING, UM, A MAJOR CHANGE OF THIS HOUSE AND, AND LARGELY TAKING IT BACK AS IT WAS ORIGINALLY BUILT? AND, UM, I GUESS YASMINE, COULD YOU, UM, COULD YOU RESTATE THE, THE ITEMS THAT STAFF IS NOT SUPPORTING JUST FOR CLARITY? SURE.
UM, THE COMMISSIONERS, MC, COMMISSIONER MCNEIL, SORRY, CAN I GET AN EXPLANATION FROM STAFF AS THE WIRE DENYING THE LIBRARY EDITION AND THE DECORATIVE SHUTTERS? RIGHT.
UM, SO THERE WAS A, HIS, AS FOR THE DECORATIVE SHUTTER THERE, THERE'S A HISTORIC PHOTO THAT DOESN'T THAT AND, AND HE'S KIND OF TAKING IT BACK TO HOW IT LOOKED IN THAT PHOTO.
AND THAT PHOTO DOESN'T HAVE DECORATIVE SHUTTERS AND THAT'S WHY, UM, BECAUSE EIGHT FIVE, I, CAN YOU GO TO THE HISTORIC PHOTO PLEASE? I THINK IT'S PAGE FIVE.
I DON'T, I DON'T HAVE THE WHOLE REPORT WITH ME RIGHT THERE ON THE BOTTOM.
UM, AS FOR THE LIBRARY EDITION, UM, YOU CAN SEE THE, CAN WE GO TO THE SITE PLAN PLEASE, JASON? OR JUST SCROLL UP? WE'LL, YOU'LL SEE IT RIGHT, RIGHT ABOVE THIS PICTURE? YES.
UM, IT'S, IT HAS A SMALLER FRONT SETBACK, SO IT'S BEYOND THE ORIGINAL HOUSE.
AND ALTHOUGH WE, WE, THE, THE, THE ADDITION IS, UM, PROPERLY SITUATED, THE ONE IN THE BACK, BUT THIS ONE IS TOO CLOSE.
SO USUALLY SITE ADDITIONS HAVE TO BE, UM, A BIT TOWARD THE REAR.
AND HIS IS IN FRONT OF, ACTUALLY IN FRONT OF THE ORIGINAL HOME.
IN FRONT OF THE ORIGINAL HOUSE.
AND WE LOOKED IN CON IN CONTEXT AREA TO SEE IF THERE'S SOMETHING SIMILAR AND THERE'S NOT.
AND THAT IS WHY, UM, WE, WE TOLD HIM THAT WE CAN'T APPROVE IT, RECOMMEND APPROVAL, YOU GUYS APPROVE IT.
SO IF THE LIBRARY WERE SAY, BACK OF THE FRONT FACADE OF THE HOUSE, YOU MIGHT CONSIDER THAT AS SOMETHING YOU WOULD ALLOW THE OWNER TO MOVE FORWARD WITH? YES, AND WE'VE, HE, HE'S DONE A, A PRE-DESIGN BEFORE HE SUBMITTED AND, UM, WE TOLD HIM THAT IT'S BETTER FOR HIM TO REDESIGN, BUT I, I THINK THE OWNER REALLY WANTED TO TRY AND, AND GIVE THIS A TRY.
AND SO WE RESPECTED HIS OPINION OF COURSE.
AND YAI, MY QUESTION IS, IS GENERALLY SPEAKING FOR SIGHT EDITION, UM, WHAT IS, WHAT IS, FROM YOUR PERSPECTIVE, FROM STAFF'S POSITION, HOW FAR BACK WOULD THE ADDITION BE IF IT WAS ON THE SIDE? GENERALLY IS IS IT THE REAR 50%? YES.
OF THE, OF THE SIDE OF THE MAIN HOME.
THAT'S, THAT'S HOW WE USUALLY LIKE TO SEE IT TOWARDS THE REAR 50%? YES.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OF STAFF? SURE.
BLAKE, I HAVE A QUESTION PLEASE.
UM, A LETTER OF OPPOSITION WAS MENTIONED.
SO AT THE END, THE ARCHITECTURAL, UM, COMMITTEE OF BROAD ACRES, UH, SUBMITTED AN EMAIL, UM, AND THEY, UM, WERE KIND OF ON THE SAME PAGE.
AND, AND THEY CALL, IT'S A LETTER OF OPPOSITION.
SO IT'S TOWARDS THE REAR OF THE, THE END OF THE REPORT.
IS THERE IS DO WE HAVE A COPY OF THE LETTER OF OPPOSITION? IT'S INCLUDED IN THE FINAL REPORT AND THAT'S WHY THERE ARE NO COPIES HERE.
[00:20:01]
ON PAGE THIRD, YES.AND YASMINE, THE, AS I RECALL THERE, THEY MADE SOME REFERENCE TO THE SIDE EDITION THAT IS, THAT IS WITHIN THE REAR 50%.
UM, THEY MADE A COMMENT ABOUT THAT AS I UNDERSTAND, AS I RECALL.
SO, SO THEY ARE ALSO OPPOSING THE, THE LIBRARY EDITION AND UM, I BELIEVE, I CAN'T SEE HERE, BUT, UM, THE, THE SHUTTERS AS WELL.
NO, THEY'RE ALSO MAKING COMMENTS ABOUT THE, UH, WINDOWS REPLACEMENT SHOULD BE IN KIND MATERIALS YES.
AND SO, SO THAT'S ONE OF THE KEY ITEMS HERE.
UM, HE WANTED TO, HE'S PROPOSING TO REPLACE ALL WINDOWS WITH ALUMINUM AND, UM, CLADD WOOD.
UM, FROM OUR POINT OF VIEW, THE, THE MATERIAL SPECIFICALLY IS NOT THE PROBLEM, BUT THE, THE FIRST OF ALL, WE ALWAYS WANNA REPAIR.
SO WE REQUESTED A SITE VISIT TO COME AND LOOK AT THE WINDOWS, BUT THE ARCHITECT WASN'T AVAILABLE.
UM, AND SO WE SAID, YOU, YOU NEED TO TRY AND REPAIR, SEE AND SEE WHATEVER IS BEYOND REPAIR, THOSE CAN BE REPLACED.
AND THEN WHEN YOU REPLACE THEM, YOU HAVE TO REPLACE THEM WITH, UM, SOMETHING THAT LOOKS VERY SIMILAR, SAME PROFILE.
UM, IF THE MATERIAL IS DIFFERENT, IT'S OKAY, BUT I THINK THE, THE BROAD ACRES ARCHITECTURAL BORDER, EVEN AGAINST ALUMINUM, CLADD WOOD, THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE WOOD WINDOWS.
BUT, UM, OUR RECOMMENDATION THAT WE, WE WANNA SEE WE'RE HE WON'T, I I LOOK, IF YOU SEE THE WINDOWS, THEY DON'T LOOK THAT THEY ARE BEYOND REPAIR.
UM, AND SO WE, WE SAID WE NEEDED TO COME ON A SAY, VISIT AND VERIFY.
AND WHILE YOU HAVEN'T SEEN 'EM IN PERSON, MY QUESTION IS, DO THEY APPEAR THAT THEY ARE MATCHING THE ORIGINAL WINDOWS BEFORE THIS LARGE WRAPAROUND PORCH WAS ADDED? LIKE, DO, DO WE KNOW, I MEAN AT THIS POINT, ARE YOU, DO YOU HAVE CERTAINTY ON WHETHER THE WINDOWS ARE ORIGINAL OR WHETHER THEY ACTUALLY ARE A LATER, UM, A LATER WINDOW THAT WOULD, THAT CAME ABOUT ALONG WITH THIS, THIS HUGE CHANGE THAT HAPPENED TO THE HOUSE AT ONE POINT? UM, SO FROM THE PICTURES, WE THINK THEY'RE ORIGINAL AND HE DOES SAY THAT THEY LOOK LIKE THEY'RE ORIGINAL.
BUT, BUT AGAIN, HE, HE SAID WE WEREN'T ABLE TO GO ON A SITE VISIT TO, TO LOOK, TO LOOK AT THEM AS, UM, THE ARCHITECT WASN'T AVAILABLE.
MR. YAP, YOU HAD A QUESTION? YEAH.
UM, IF I GO BACK TO THE LETTER ON PAGE 30, THERE ARE TWO SECTIONS TO THAT LETTER.
UH, THERE ARE A SECOND SECTION HAS FIVE POINTS.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO, UH, TO MAKE SURE THAT THOSE, ANY OF THOSE FIVE POINTS THAT ARE WITHIN THE PURVIEW OF THE PRESERVATION OFFICE BE REVIEWED IN GREAT DETAIL.
UM, ESPECIALLY THE ONES THAT ARE TALKING ABOUT MAYBE THE ROOFING MATERIAL OR UTILITY OR, UH, EASEMENTS AND ALL THAT, THAT, THAT MAY HAVE, MAY CONCERN US WHEN IT COMES TO THE, UH, BOUNDARIES OF THE BUILDING WITH THE BOUNDARIES OF THE PROPERTY.
UM, AND I, I THINK THERE, THEY MIGHT BE TALKING ABOUT THE, UM, ABOUT THE ADDITION EXCEEDING THE FRONT SETBACK OF THE ORIGINAL HOUSE.
THAT MIGHT BE ONE OF THEM AS WELL.
BUT SURE, WE CAN TAKE THEIR POINTS INTO CONSIDERATION.
WELL THEY WERE ALSO TALKING ABOUT DORMERS AS WELL AS THE ELEVATION WAS NOT COMPLETE.
THEY DIDN'T HAVE A COMPLETE PICTURE OF THE ELEVATION OF THE GARAGE AS WELL.
SO I THINK THE, WE SHOULD, UH, WE SHOULD BE SENSITIVE TOWARDS THE, THE BROAD ACRES ARCHITECTURAL, UH, DESIGN OR COMMITTEES, UH, REQUIREMENTS THERE.
UM, SO COMMISSIONER YAP, THE, THE, THE DRAWING SET HE SUBMITTED DID HAVE THE HOUSE WITHOUT THE GARAGE, BUT THERE, BUT HE ALSO INCLUDED A SET THAT DID INCLUDE THE GARAGE.
SO IF YOU, UM, JASON, IF YOU SCROLL DOWN, THE REAR ELEVATION DOES SHOW IT WITH THE EXISTING GARAGE AND THEN WITH THE PROPOSED.
UM, BUT SO I I, I THINK THEY DIDN'T SEE THE ONE THAT INCLUDED THE EXISTING GARAGE.
UM, THEY WERE ALSO JUST TALKING ABOUT THAT THE EXISTING GARAGE NEEDS TO BE INCLUDED IN THE DRAWINGS.
WELL JUST, JUST BE MINDFUL THAT THERE ARE COMMITTEES RECOMMENDATION.
I'LL WEAVE INTO WHAT PO IS DOING AS WELL.
WELL, IS THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? ANY DISCUSSION ON THE SIDE EDITION COMMENT? I THINK THAT COMMENT WAS JUST BASED ON, THEY WERE FINE HAVING IT, BUT IT WAS, IT WAS, IT WAS HOW FAR IT WAS PUSHED OUT.
I THINK IT WAS THEIR COMMENT WAS, UM, BUT THAT WAS ON ISSUE FOR STAFF AND IT WAS IN THE REAR 50% OF THE STRUCTURE FOR CLARITY.
IS THERE NO OTHER DISCUSSION? IS THERE A RECOMMENDATION?
[00:25:02]
UM, IS THERE A MOTION? UM, I'D MAKE A MOTION TO ACCEPT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION.I THINK THEY'VE NARROWED, HONED IN ON, ON THE ISSUES HERE.
ANY OPPOSED? ANY ABSTENTIONS? OKAY, THAT MOTION PASSES AND WE WILL MOVE ON TO ITEM A FIVE.
GOOD AFTERNOON CHAIR, DIRECTOR, COMMISSIONERS AND THE PUBLIC.
THIS IS STAFF PERSON CHARLES SADLER.
TODAY I SUBMIT FOR YOU 8 1 5 WEST COTTAGE STREET IN NOR HILL.
AND THE PROPOSAL IS FOR AN ADDITION TO AN ORIGINAL HOUSE PLUS A NEW DETACHED GARAGE, WHICH INCLUDES ADDITION, REPAIR AND UPDATE.
FRONT PORCH, REPLACE COLUMNS, STEPS RAILINGS, BAST TRADES, REPLACE FRONT DOOR WITH A VINTAGE CRAFTSMAN STYLE DOOR, UH, CHANGE THE DECKING MATERIAL.
AND THEN THERE'S A REAR ADDITION, WHICH IS PART OF THIS, WHICH IS ADDITION OF A BEDROOM AND BATHROOM TOTALING 700 SQUARE FEET.
THE KEY PART OF THE FRONT ADDITION IS CHANGING THE ORIENTATION OF THE STEPS TO THE FRONT DOOR WOULD BE DIRECTLY TO THE STREET AS OPPOSED TO RIGHT NOW IT'S A SIDE, UH, ENTRANCE TO THE FRONT PORCH.
THE DETACHED GARAGE IS A NEW SINGLE STORY, 496 SQUARE FEET.
UH, WOOD SIDING, UH, CEMENTITIOUS BOARD ON THE FIRE RATED SIDE.
WITHIN THE IT WITHIN THE SETBACK, UH, THERE IS PUBLIC COMMENT ON NOR HILL NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION.
AND THAT'S ON THE LAST PAGE, I BELIEVE.
AND, AND THEIR POINT IS THAT THE ORIENTATION OF ENTERING THE FRONT PORCH FROM THE SIDE, UH, IS MORE, IS BE, IS MORE BENEFICIAL, IS IN KEEPING WITH THE, WITH THE SETBACKS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
UM, AND THAT THEY FEEL IF THE STEPS PROTRUDED FROM THEIR FRONT PORCH TO THE STREET, THAT IT WOULD BE, IT WOULD BE PERCEIVED AS TOO CLOSE TO THE STREET.
AND SO THAT'S, THAT IS THE END OF MY REPORT.
IF THERE'S ANY QUESTIONS? SORRY, WE HAVE A QUESTION.
MR. MCNEIL, DO YOU HAVE ANY INVENTORY PHOTOS OF, OF THE HOUSE AND WAS IT EVER ORIENTED TO THE STREET? UH, YEAH, WE DO HAVE PHOTOS IN THERE.
AND IT, IT WAS NOT ORIENTED TOWARD THE STREET IN, IN THE INVENTORY PHOTO.
IT DOESN'T APPEAR TO THAT THE STEPS WOULD FALL WITHIN THE 10 TO 15 FOOT SETBACKS ALONG THE BLOCK FACE.
RIGHT? IT WOULD STILL, FROM THE INVENTORY I TOOK, THE, THE STEPS WOULD STILL BE BEHIND THAT, CORRECT? RIGHT ON, ON THE NEXT PAGE, ON PAGE FIVE MM-HMM
I DETAILED THAT, THAT THE AVERAGE FRONT PORCH STEP SETBACK IS ABOUT 10 TO 15 FEET.
SO AS PROPOSED, THESE STEPS WOULD NOT BE THE CLOSEST.
THERE'S OTHER HOUSES THAT ARE EVEN CLOSER.
NOT A LOT OF THEM, BUT IT'S LIKE WITHIN THE RANGE I FELT.
AND DO WE KNOW IF THERE WAS EVER ANY EVIDENCE OF STEPS FACING THE STREET? 'CAUSE SEEING IT COME OFF THE SITE DOESN'T SEEM LIKE THE TYPICAL WAY THESE PORCHES WERE, UH, THERE WAS NO EVIDENCE THAT IT CAME STRAIGHT OFF.
I MEAN, FROM THIS, FROM THE SANBORN AND THE BLA, IT'S, THERE'S NO EVIDENCE TO TELL EX EXCEPT THAT THERE, THAT THERE WAS A PORCH, UH, DATING WAY BACK TO THE BEGINNING.
BUT LOOKING AT, UM, PLEASE, LOOKING AT THE AERIAL PHOTO THAT'S INCLUDED ALONG WITH THE LETTER FROM THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION.
IT LOOKS AS THOUGH, IF I'M READING THE PHOTO CORRECTLY, THAT HOUSE MIGHT BE SLIGHTLY CLOSER TO THE STREET THAN ITS NEIGHBORS.
UH, BUT ALSO IT LOOKS AS THOUGH SOME OF THE ADJACENT HOUSES MIGHT ALSO HAVE FRONT ENTRY, UH, PORCHES.
SO IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT AN ELEVATION ISSUE, I SUPPOSE, BUT IT DOES LOOK AS THOUGH IT, THE H THAT HOUSE IS ALREADY HAS A, AN EXTENSION ON THE FRONT THAT'S CLOSER TO THE SIDEWALK THAN ITS NEIGHBORS.
IT, IT IS CLOSER TO THE STREET THAN SOME OF THE HOUSES.
THE HOUSE THAT'S DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET, THAT'S EVEN A LITTLE CLOSER.
[00:30:01]
BUT YOU'RE RIGHT, THERE'S HOUSES THAT HAVE A FURTHER SETBACK.CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION PLEASE? COMMISSIONER COSGROVE.
SO ON PAGE SEVEN IN THE REPORT, THE CURRENT PHOTO, IS THAT A CONCRETE PAD AT THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE? I BELIEVE IT IS, YES.
SO THERE, SO THAT POTENTIALLY COULD HAVE BEEN THE LANDING FOR THE PORCH STAIRS.
I MEAN, OTHERWISE IT'S JUST A RANDOM CONCRETE PAD.
COMMISSIONER COUCH AND I ARE DEBATING IF IT HAS ANY ORIGINALITY TO IT AT ALL.
WOULD LOVE COMMISSIONER CURRY'S OR COMMISSIONER YAPS INPUT IF YOU THINK THAT CONCRETE PORCH IS THE ORIGINAL FRONT PORCH WITH THE SIDE LANDING, OR IF IT WAS THE ORIGINAL PORCH WAS DEMOLISHED.
'CAUSE CLEARLY THE RAILING'S NOT ORIGINAL AT ALL.
UM, I DID NOT KNOW IN THIS CASE.
COULD WE ENLARGE THAT PHOTOGRAPH THAT'S CURRENTLY UP TO LOOK AT THE PORCH RAILING AND THEN, I MEAN, IT DOESN'T APPEAR TO BE MORE THAN ONE STEP.
WE'RE NOT TALKING SIX STEPS COMING OUT TOWARDS THE STREET, RIGHT? ONE.
IT, SO IT WOULD COME ON ABOUT TWO FEET, I BELIEVE, IS WHAT WE DETERMINED.
IT SEEMS LIKE THERE'S JUST BE ONE STEP, THE STEP IS JUST ONE STEP IN THAT PHOTO.
I MEAN, ACTUALLY PART OF THE PROPOSAL IS TO, IS TO RAISE THE PORCH AND, AND, AND TO MATCH THE NEIGHBORHOOD, WHICH WOULD BE A, A CARPENTRY PORCH.
PORCH INSTEAD OF A MASONRY PORCH.
SO WOULD IT BE, WOULD IT BE FAIR TO SAY THAT IT'S LIKELY THAT THE CONCRETE PORCH THERE IS NOT THE ORIGINAL? THAT IF THERE WAS THERE, WE KNOW THERE WAS A PORCH THERE FROM THE SANDBORN, LIKELY IT WOULD'VE BEEN WOOD FRAMED, IT WOULD'VE BEEN HIGHER, UH, THAN THE CURRENT LOWER PORCH, WHICH MIGHT'VE BEEN A REPLACEMENT AT SOME POINT.
MAYBE THE FIRST ONE ROTTED OUT.
UM, AND THEN CAN YOU, UH, BY RAISING THAT UP THOUGH, THEY'D BE RAISING THIS UP OR THEY'D BE RECONSTRUCTING IT WITH OUTTA WOOD.
THEY'D BE RECONSTRUCTING IT OUT OF WOOD.
I THINK THAT'S A FAIR ASSESSMENT.
SO WHAT, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN FOR THE COLUMNS? THEY WOULD BE CUT OFF PRESUMABLY TO MAKE WAY FOR THE, I MEAN, YOU CAN SEE THAT THE THRESHOLD IS SIGNIFICANTLY LOW, HIGHER THAN THE CURRENT PORCH.
SO I MEAN, THIS WOULD GO TO THE ELEVATION, POTENTIALLY CHANGE THE SCALE, NOT THE ELEVATION.
ON PAGE 10, LEMME JUST SAY, IF YOU DON'T MIND YEAH, GO AHEAD.
THE OWNERS HERE CAN ANSWER THOSE SPECIFIC QUESTIONS.
I DO HAVE TWO PEOPLE SIGN UP TO SPEAK.
SO ON THE SIDE THEY MAY BE ABLE TO CLARIFY SOME ASPECTS.
IS IT KNOWN IF THE PORCH IS ORIGINAL? 'CAUSE IT LOOKS, IT'S HARD TO TELL.
IT'S NOT NOTED, BUT THERE'S NOT EVIDENCE THAT IT'S ORIGINAL.
YEAH, AND IT, I WOULD SAY IT APPEARS, IT APPEARS NOT TO BE ORIGINAL LIKE A, IT'S LIKE A SECOND GENERATION PORCH PERHAPS, WHERE THE ORIGINAL PORCH WAS FIRST BUILT.
WELL AT THIS TIME LET ME OPEN UP A PUBLIC HEARING.
I DO HAVE TWO SPEAKERS SIGNED UP TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM AND WE MAY ABLE TO GET MORE CLARITY ON SOME OF THESE QUESTIONS.
UH, THE FIRST SPEAKER WHO WAS SIGNED UP FOR THIS ITEM, MR. ROB? UH, ROD FRIGO.
HEY, FIRST OF ALL, UH, ON THIS PORCH WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, IT'S ILLEGAL.
IT ALMOST PUT ME RIGHT THROUGH THAT WINDOW.
IT GOES FROM SIX INCHES TO 12 INCHES AND IT'S TOO CLOSE TO THAT WINDOW.
LEAVE THAT AND TAKE THE WINDOW OUT OR CHANGE THE GLASS TO TEMPERED, BECAUSE ACCORDING TO THE FIRE MARSHAL AND EVERYBODY ELSE'S RULES, WHEN WE HAVE STEPS, WE CAN'T HAVE THIN GLASS WINDOWS WHERE PEOPLE COULD FALL THROUGH 'EM.
BUT THAT PORCH IS NOT ORIGINAL.
I'M GONNA PUT IT BACK TO THE 1920 PORCH TREATED WOOD FLOORING ON THE POST.
WE'RE GONNA PUT NEW ONES IN AND WRAP 'EM, JUST LIKE THEY WERE, THEY'RE ALL ROTTED ON THE BOTTOM.
AND YOU COULD TELL, IF YOU LOOK AT THE PICTURE CLOSE ENOUGH UNDERNEATH IT, IT HAD BRICK.
SO I BELIEVE THERE WAS THAT ONE TIME, A BRICK COLUMN UNDER THERE.
AND IF YOU LOOK AT IT TOO, IT'S LIKE THIS, IT'S ABOUT SIX INCHES BELOW THE DOOR THRESHOLD.
SO YOU HAVE TO JUMP INTO THE HOUSE.
AND YOU KNOW WHAT, HOW THE HELL CAN A, A CONCRETE PORCH BE HISTORIC? YOU KNOW, IN THE TWENTIES THEY HARDLY USE
[00:35:01]
CONCRETE, SO I'M NOT GONNA TAKE A WHOLE LOT OF YOUR TIME.BUT I'M GONNA MAKE IT LOOK JUST LIKE ALL THE REST OF 'EM WE DO AND WE DON'T BUILD JUNK.
I DON'T EVEN THINK CITY INSPECTOR WOULD ALLOW THAT TO STAY THERE BECAUSE I ALMOST FELL THROUGH IT.
ONE END'S SIX INCHES, THE OTHER END'S 12, AND IT'S TWISTED.
SO WHEN YOU WALK UP IT, YOUR FOOT GETS CAUGHT UP UNDERNEATH IT A FLIP.
WE'VE GOT TWO PEOPLE GET FLIPPED.
THAT'S WHY I'M ANXIOUS TO GET IT PULLED OUT OF THERE.
WE'LL MAKE IT LOOK NICE FOR YOU.
OKAY, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OF THIS? THE SPEAKER FROM STAFF? HOLD ON SECOND.
I'M SORRY,
BUT WE, BUT I DO HAVE ONE MORE SPEAKER SIGNED UP ON THIS ITEM.
AND THAT'S, UM, AMANDA REYNOLDS FIRE OUT.
RESTATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS THE COMMISSION.
I'M PRESIDENT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD NOR HILL, UH, ASSOCIATION.
UM, I, I DON'T THINK THAT THE, THE CONCERN THAT WE HAVE WAS CHARACTERIZED EXACTLY THE WAY THAT WE STATED IT.
IT'S NOT A SETBACK ISSUE IN OUR MIND.
UM, OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, TYPICALLY, THE FRONT FACE OF THE HOUSES IS ON A BLOCK FACE IS VERY CONSISTENT AND THE PORCHES TEND TO ALSO BE VERY CONSISTENT IN THAT.
UM, IF WE COULD PULL BACK THE PHOTO THAT WE SUBMITTED, UM, FROM THE, THE SATELLITE PHOTO, YOU CAN SEE THAT THE MAJORITY OF PORCHES IN THIS, IN THIS BLOCK FACE REFLECT WHAT'S TYPICAL FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD WHERE THEY'RE EXACTLY, UM, IN LINE WITH EACH OTHER.
UM, THIS HOUSE THAT IS SET FOR REMODEL IS ATYPICAL.
UM, AND IT'S, IT IS WHAT IT IS.
WE'RE NOT ASKING IT TO BE PUSHED BACK TO THE REST OF THE HOUSES NEXT TO IT.
WHAT OUR CONCERN IS, IS THAT BY CHANGING THE ENTRYWAY TO THE FRONT AND ADDING ONE OR TWO STAIRS AS THEY RAISE THE PORCH, THAT IT WILL FURTHER ACCENTUATE THAT IT IS ATYPICAL FOR THE, FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
WE THINK THE REST OF THE RENOVATION IS, IS IN KEEPING WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
ARE THERE OTHER QUESTIONS OF THIS SPEAKER FROM, I GUESS I WOULD ASK, UH, PLEASE.
COMMISSIONER BLAKELY, I WOULD ASK, UM, WHAT IF THE PORCH WAS REBUILT BUT SHALLOWER, UH, BUT STILL FRONT ENTRY, WOULD THAT ALSO BE OBJECTIONABLE OR NO, THAT WOULD BE, I THINK WE'D BE PERFECTLY FINE WITH THAT AS IF IT WAS IN LINE IN THE SAME HEIGHT AS THE SURROUNDING PORCHES.
AND MY QUESTION FOR STAFF WOULD BE, NOT THAT THEY COULD TELL, BUT, UM, I GUESS CHARLES, IT APPEARS THE PORCH IS NOT ORIGINAL, BUT DOES THE CURRENT PORCH CONFIGURATION APPEAR TO MATCH THE SANDBORN IN TERMS OF HOW LARGE THE ORIGINAL PORCH WAS PER THE SANDBORN? JUST AS A MATTER OF PROPORTION? UM, DOES IT, DOES IT SEEM TO BE DIFFERENT IN SIZE OR DOES IT SEEM TO BE SIMILAR? I WOULD SAY IT'S CONSISTENT.
YOU KNOW, PROPORTIONATELY THAT IT'S, THAT THAT RECTANGULAR SHAPE IS, IT'S BELIEVABLE THAT IT'S THE SAME PROPORTIONS.
I DON'T THINK IT LOOKS THE SAME.
ROMAN, DO YOU HAVE MORE TO, WELL, UH, TO ADD, YOU'VE GOT TECHNOLOGY.
IF WE COULD STAY WITH THE, WELL THERE, YOU SEE WHAT'S GOING ON THERE.
SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE SANDBORN AND HOW THAT PORCH LINED UP BEFORE THAT HOME USED, EITHER THAT HOME THAT'S IN THE SANDBORN MAP WAS LINED UP WELL, OR THAT SANDBORN, THAT HOME IN THE SANDBORN MAP ISN'T THERE ANYMORE BECAUSE IT HAS THAT BUMP OUT ON THE LEFT SIDE, YOU SEE.
AND THEN IF YOU GO TO THE BLA BELOW, UH, IT'S GONE.
AND THEN THERE'S A DIFFERENT SORT OF SYSTEM.
SO SOMETHING YOU KNOW, A LOT AS, AND WE'D HAVE TO GO UP IN THE ROOF TO FIGURE OUT IS THAT THE SAME HOUSE OR, OR IS IT A HOME OR, YOU KNOW, WITH A MAJOR CHANGE WITH MAJOR CHANGES OR IT'S A TOTALLY DIFFERENT HOUSE.
UM, IT COULD HAVE BEEN MODIFIED, YOU'RE, YOU'RE SAYING, SORRY.
MM-HMM
AND ALTHOUGH SOME PEOPLE OCCASIONALLY WILL CRITICIZE THE SANDBORN, I HAVE FOUND THEM TO BE EXTREMELY ACCURATE.
ALMOST NEVER HAVE FOUND THEM TO BE OFF IN MY 12 YEARS IN DIFFERENT CITIES.
POINT OF CLARITY, PLEASE, PLEASE, MR. MCNEIL, THAT'S THE ORIGINAL SANBORN I BELIEVE IN BLUE IS WHAT ROMAN IS SAYING.
[00:40:01]
THE CURRENT HOME FOOTPRINT DOESN'T MATCH THAT FOOTPRINT.SO IT APPEARS THAT EITHER IF THERE'S A DIFFERENT HOME THERE OR THE HOME IN THE SANDBORN WAS MODIFIED AND THE, AND THE HOME IN ADDITION TO THE SIDE NOT MATCHING, IT MAY BE STICKING FURTHER TOWARD THE STREET THAN THE ORIGINAL SANDBORN.
WE'D HAVE TO BLOW UP THAT AERIAL PICTURE.
IT'S HARD TO SEE ON THE SCREEN RIGHT NOW.
IF WE HAVE TO, WE'D HAVE TO LOOK REALLY ENLARGE IT EVEN MORE TO GET A SENSE WHERE THE FRONT OF THAT HOME IS.
I, I GUESS THE, THE, THE KEY THING IS THAT THE CURRENTLY IT APPEARS THE HOME IS CLOSER TO THE FRONT THAN THE OTHER HOMES.
BASED ON THE AERIAL PHOTOGRAPH, THEY PICK IT UP AND MOVE IT FORWARD.
WELL, OR THEY, OR THAT CONCRETE PORCH IS JUST BIGGER THAN THE ORIGINAL ONES OR, OR SOME, THERE WERE SOME CHANGES TO THE HOUSE AT SOME POINT MANY, MANY YEARS AGO THAT ENLARGED THE HOME.
THAT, I MEAN, I THINK WITHOUT GOING TO THE LIKE, WELL ROMAN, WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS YOU COULD GO AND PROBABLY GET IN THE ATTIC AND LOOK AROUND AND SEE WHETHER IT WAS ORIGINAL LOOKING OR WHETHER IT LOOKED LIKE HAD BEEN MODIFIED.
BUT THERE'S SOME, THERE'S SOME ISSUE THERE OF DISCREPANCY THAT'S MISLEADING AT LEAST.
UM, UM, MR. CHAIR, I HAVE A QUESTION AS WELL.
UM, ACTUALLY THE QUESTION IS MORE TOWARDS, FOR THE, UH, THE OWNER OF THE PROJECT, UM, BASED ON THE PHOTO THAT I SEE THAT THE HOUSE IS VERY LOW TO THE GROUND, LIKELY ONLY ONE BLOCK HIGH, UH, WHAT IS THE INTENT? DO YOU NEED TO, DO YOU WANT TO RAISE IT? AND WILL THAT, UH, HOW MANY BLOCKS WILL YOU BE RAISING THE HOUSE TO? UH, IF I WOULD END, THERE'LL BE ONE, ONE BLOCK, ONE PATH.
SO ON TWO PADS UNDER WITH A FOUR BY SIX SEAL, WHICH ARE ROTTED OUT.
A LOT OF THOSE ARE DILAPIDATED.
I MEAN, WE, WE PULLED THE FLOOR UP OUTTA THE BATHROOM.
NOW PROBLEM IS RAISING, IT IS, THEN IT DOESN'T GO WITH ALL THE REST OF THE HOUSES AROUND IT.
NOW THE GUY ACROSS THE STREET WENT A BLOCK HIGH.
SO MY, MY QUESTION IS THAT, DO YOU INTEND TO RAISE IT FROM S IS ANOTHER BLOCK HIGHER? I'VE RAISE IT ABOUT A PAD.
DIDN'T YOU SAY IT'S ROUGHLY A SIX INCH JUMP FROM THE EDGE OF THE PORCH INTO THE HOUSE? YEAH, I, I BELIEVE WHEN THEY TOOK THE ORIGINAL PORCH OUT, THEY JUST CAPPED CONCRETE RIGHT THERE.
I BELIEVE THAT PORCH IS CAPPED OVER BRICK.
BUT THE POINT IS, I'M ASKING YOU FROM WHERE IT IS NOW, ROUGHLY, YOU'RE PLANTED TO RAISE IT APPROXIMATELY SIX INCHES TO BE CLOSE TO THE FOUR, FOUR INCHES.
BUT NOW I'M GONNA HAVE THE PORCH REGULARLY, LIKE WITH THE, LIKE MOST PORCHES, SHOULD YOU, YOU SHOULDN'T BE JUMPING INTO YOUR HOUSE.
IT SHOULD BE LINED UP WITH A THRESHOLD THAT IT A SLAY IT.
I THINK IT'S ONE INCH PER 10 FEET BY ENGINEERING SCALES POSITIVE SLOPE AWAY FROM THE HOUSE.
DAVE KNOW THAT BETTER THAN I WOULD.
YEAH, HE'S GOT A LEVEL ON EVERYTHING.
WHAT ABOUT THE, WHILE I GOT YOU, WHAT ABOUT THE, THE ROOF OF THE PORCH ITSELF IS THAT I'M STAYING, I'M GONNA PUT IT ON TEMPORARIES PULL AND POST OUT AND PUT THEM POSTS BACK JUST THE WAY THEY WERE.
THE BEADED CEILING IN THAT ROOF LOOKS UNTOUCHED.
THAT'S WHY I BELIEVE IF I GET LOOKING AT THE BACKSIDE OF THAT, THAT IT WAS REMODELED AT ONE OTHER TIME.
I'VE DONE A LOT OF THESE HOUSES, I NEVER HAD ONE.
JUST THE FOUNDATION GOT DILAPIDATED AND UH, THIS DEAL WITH THE FRONT PORCH, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY'RE PLANNING ON DOING WITH THAT, BUT IT'S PRETTY WELL SHOT.
DO YOU THINK THE FRONT PORCH, THE UPPER FRAMING THOUGH, IS ORIGINAL TO THE HOME BASED ON WHAT YOU'VE SEEN? YEAH.
THE RAFTERS AND STUFF, BUT ALL THE COSMETICS ON THE OUT OR THE WRAPPING OF THE BEAMS AND EVEN THE WRAPPING OF THOSE COLUMNS YOU'RE LOOKING AT, THAT'S NOT THE WAY THEY WRAP COLUMNS BACK IN THE OLD DAYS.
THEY, THEY DON'T HAVE NO TRIM ON 'EM.
YOU KNOW, THEY'RE KIND OF REALLY, I I ACTUALLY, I LIKE TO MODIFY IT TO MAKE IT LOOK LIKE THE, THE OLD TIME COLUMNS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
IF SOMEBODY KIND OF BLINKS AND GOES BY, THEY WON'T SEE IT.
SO THE PUBLIC HEARING IS STILL OPEN IF, IF THE UH, IF THE HOUSE IS ONLY GONNA BE RAISED ANOTHER FOUR INCHES, SO TO WHAT I UNDER, EXCUSE ME, THE PORCH, NOT THE HOUSE, SORRY.
YEAH, THE, YEAH THE PORCH, RIGHT.
IT'S GONNA BE ONLY RAISED FOUR INCHES.
THEN TO ME THERE, THERE IS ONLY ONE RISER BEING ADDED TO MAKE IT MORE CONSISTENT BECAUSE MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT IS A SIX INCH AND THEN A 12 INCH JUMP TO GET INTO THE HOUSE.
AND IF THERE IS, IF THE PORCH IS GONNA BE RAISED, THEN WE ARE JUST MAKING THE STEPS MORE CONSISTENT.
[00:45:01]
IS JUST ONE EXTRA RISER, AM MY UNDERSTANDING IN INACCURATE, I MEAN THAT'S, THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT HE SAID.BUT I I THINK ARE YOU, WHAT, WHAT PART IS BEING MORE CONSISTENT? 'CAUSE IT'S CURRENTLY A SIDE ENTRYWAY, WHICH IS JUST AS CONSISTENT WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
I GUESS THAT'S THE PART I'M, I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND WHY IT WOULD BE MORE CONSISTENT TO BE FRONT.
WELL, I, MY QUESTION IS ARISING FROM WHEN YOU HAVE THE ENTRYWAY COMING IN FROM THE FRONT THAT USING THAT PORCH AS THE FRONT, RIGHT, SO THE WHOLE POINT IS THAT IF THE PORCH IS RAISED ANOTHER FOUR INCHES, THEN TO ME MAYBE IT'S A, FROM A TWO STEP SITUATION IS JUST ANOTHER, NOW IT'S A THREE STEP SITUATION.
SO THAT MEANS THE, UM, THE RISERS IS GONNA PROTRUDE OUT ANOTHER MAYBE SEVEN, EIGHT INCHES.
THAT'S THE CRUX OF THE THING THAT I SEE AS THE, AS WE TALK ABOUT FRONT ENTRY AND, AND WHAT PROTRUDES OUT IS JUST ABOUT SEVEN, EIGHT INCHES.
I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT'S OUR MAIN CONCERN AS WELL, THAT IT JUST ALL OF A SUDDEN NOW THERE'S ANOTHER OKAY.
EX ACCENTUATION TO THE FRONT THAT PUSHES OUT IT OUT EVEN FORWARD, MORE FORWARD OF WHERE IT IS NOW.
YEAH, BUT THAT HAS TO BE TEMPERED WITH SAFETY TOO.
THAT YOU CANNOT HAVE A RISER THAT IS SIX INCH AND THEN 12 INCH SOMEBODY'S GONNA TRIP OVER.
OH NO, I MEAN, BUT THEY, THE, THE QUESTION IN MY MIND IS THEY'RE JUST ASKING RIGHT NOW, IT'S CURRENTLY A SIDE ENTRYWAY ON THE PORCH, WHICH IS JUST AS TYPICAL IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
MY HOUSE IS A SIDE ENTRYWAY ONTO THE PORCH.
I WOULD SAY 50% OF THE HOUSES ARE PROBABLY SIDE ENTRYWAYS ONTO THE PORCH.
SO WE'RE JUST, THEY'RE ASKING FOR IT TO BE MOVED FORWARD.
THAT'S NOT NECESSARY TO MAKE IT TYPICAL FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD IS MY POINT.
AND AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THERE'S NO, THERE'S NO REFERENCE FOR WHAT IT WOULD'VE BEEN ORIGINALLY? NO.
IT WOULD'VE MATCHES THE ONES ACROSS THE STREET.
NUMBER TWO, MOST HOUSES IN THESE NEIGHBORHOODS ARE 21 GOING TO GO UP.
MAYBE YOU COULD ASK A QUESTION OF THAT SPEAKER.
THOSE ALLEGATIONS ON THE FLOORS ARE 21 INCHES UP IN THE AIR ON THESE OLD HOUSES.
SO IF YOU GOT THREE STEPS GOING IN, YOU'RE AT YOUR 21 INCHES.
SO DOES THIS, IS THERE ANY EVIDENCE THAT THERE WAS EVER STEPS FACING THE STREET ON THIS PORCH? THERE'S SOME CONCRETE STUFF IN FRONT OF IT WHEN YOU LOOK UNDERNEATH IT.
I THINK IT HAD BRICK COLUMNS AND THERE WAS A WAY UP IN THERE.
BUT THE THING IS, IF YOU PUT STEPS ON THE SIDE, LIKE SHE'S SAYING, YOU COULD TAKE YOUR PICK, PUT THE STEPS, TAKE YOUR WINDOW OUT OR CHANGE THE WINDOW TO TEMPER GLASS.
AND THE INSURANCE COMPANY WOULD EVEN RECOMMEND SUCK BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT GONNA LET SOMEBODY TRIP OVER THAT STEP AND GO RIGHT THROUGH THAT WINDOW.
AND WE FACE THAT BUILDING STAIRS ALL THE TIME ON GARAGE APARTMENTS.
ONE OF, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT'S BEEN DISCUSSED HERE IN THE LAST FEW MINUTES IS THE, THE POTENTIAL OPTION OF A SHOWER PORCH.
UH, I MEAN SHOWER, BUT THIS PORCH LINES RIGHT UP WITH EVERY PORCH AROUND THERE.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT, WHAT, WHAT DO YOU MEAN SHALLOW OR LESS NARROW OR LESS, LESS WIDE.
ACTUALLY IT'S PRETTY NICE THE WAY IT IS.
YOU CAN PUT A CHAIR IN FRONT OF IT, KICK YOUR FEET UP ON TOP OF THE RAIL AND DRINK A CUP OF COFFEE, YOU KNOW, BUT I MEAN, IF A FOOT MATTERS SO MUCH, YEAH, SO BE IT.
I MEAN, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM, BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S UH, THAT SHOULD BE A GAME CHANGER.
BUT IF THE FRAMING ABOVE IS STILL APPEARS TO BE ORIGINAL, THEN THE HOW FAR THE FRONT PORCH IS BUILT.
YOU'RE GONNA BUILD UNDER IT STILL STILL APPEARS AT THE MOMENT TO BE YEAH, YOU'RE RIGHT.
YOU'RE GONNA BUILD UNDER THAT ROOF LINE.
UH, WE'RE NOT GONNA MOVE THE ROOF LINE.
CAN, CAN I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION, PLEASE.
AS LONG AS THERE WAS NO MORE QUESTIONS FROM MCNEIL.
WELL PLEASE DO YOU WANNA MAKE THE MOTION? I'M, I'M GONNA CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AT THIS TIME AND, AND I'M GONNA SECOND THIS MOTION.
I, I'M, I WANNA, I WANNA HEAR IT FIRST, BUT MAKE A MOTION TO ACCEPT STAFF'S DECISION FOR APPROVAL.
ARE THERE ANY OTHER DISCUSSION AMONGST COMMISSION MEMBERS? CAN I ASK ONE QUESTION TO THE STAFF? OH, YOU CAN, YES, PLEASE.
OH, MR. COSGROVE IS THE FLOORING I CAN ASK YOU IS THE PORCH FLOORING IT'S TONGUE AND GROOVE? YEAH, IT'S UH, THE STANDARD THREE AND A HALF OR THREE INCH TONGUE AND GROOVE TREATED KIND OF BLENDS IN.
IT'LL BE RUNNING THE SAME WAY THAT THE BEADED CEILINGS RUNNING.
ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION? AYE.
ARE THERE ANY OPPOSED? OKAY, RON SET.
ARE THERE ANY ABSTENTIONS? I AB BLAKELY ABSTAINS
[00:50:01]
BLAKE BLAKELY ABSTAINS.THAT MOTION PASSES ROMAN, I THINK WE WORKED THROUGH, AM I CORRECT THAT WE'VE WORKED THROUGH OUR LIST OF, UM, CONSENT ITEMS AND IT'S JUST A HOUSEKEEPING, UH, NOTE THE, I UNDERSTAND THERE WERE SOME HAND COPIES OF THE AGENDA HANDED OUT THAT HAD A B AND A C, WHICH WERE CHANGES OF DESIGNATION.
SO SOME OF YOU MAY BE HOLDING A DOCUMENT THAT SAYS THERE'S A B AND A C WITH A CHANGE OF DEC, BUT THAT FINAL AGENDA DID NOT HAVE THOSE B AND CS.
UH, THOSE ITEMS WE HOPE TO BRING FORWARD TO YOU NEXT MONTH.
SO WE WOULD BE MOVING TO B, WHICH WOULD BE COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC.
AND I DO HAVE A, UM, A SPEAKER SIGNED UP, UM, IS MY UNDERSTANDING.
SO AGAIN, AMANDA REYNOLDS, IF YOU COULD PLEASE ADDRESS THE COMMISSION.
HI, SORRY TO TAKE MORE TO YOUR TIME.
UH, AMANDA REYNOLDS, NEIGHBORHOOD NOR HILL ASSOCIATION PRESIDENT.
UM, AS SOME OF YOU MAY BE AWARE, UM, WE AS A NEIGHBORHOOD ARE TRYING TO PUSH, UM, GUIDELINES THROUGH BOTH FROM A CITY PERSPECTIVE AS WELL AS THROUGH OUR OWN, UM, NEIGHBORHOOD PERSPECTIVE TO GET IT THROUGH THE PROPERTY CODE, UM, INTO, IN PARALLEL.
UM, IT'LL BE COMING YOUR WAY SHORTLY.
IT'S CURRENTLY JUST IN NEIGHBORHOOD FEEDBACK SESSIONS FOR THE NEXT MONTH OR SO.
UM, BUT I WANTED TO KIND OF, UM, PUT FORWARD SOME STATISTICS FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
UM, THERE'VE BEEN A FEW, I THINK PEOPLE ARE ASKING FOR BIGGER AND BIGGER HOUSES, UM, COMING INTO OUR NEIGHBORHOOD AS DEVELOPMENT IN OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS.
IT'S KIND OF GOTTEN FILLED UP.
UM, THERE'S BEEN A FEW BIG PROPERTIES THAT YOU AS A COMMISSION HAVE APPROVED AT 21 AT 2,800 3000 SQUARE FEET.
AND I WANTED JUST TO SHARE SOME STATISTICS OF LIKE WHAT OUR NEIGHBORHOOD LOOKS LIKE STATISTICALLY.
UM, JUST TO KIND OF MAKE SURE YOU'RE AWARE OF WHAT A 3000 SQUARE FOOT HOUSE DOES TO THE STATISTICS FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
UM, I HAVE, CAN I USE YOUR ELMO THING? SURE.
SO WHAT WE DID AS A NEIGHBORHOOD IS WE PULLED ALL OF THE HCA DATA OR SCRAPED IT, SO TO SPEAK.
UM, SO WE HAVE ALL THE STATISTICS FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
UM, HERE ARE TWO HISTOGRAMS WITH PHOTO EXAMPLES KIND OF POINTING TO WHERE THEY ARE IN SQUARE FOOTAGE.
UM, THESE TWO HISTOGRAMS ARE THE, UM, CURRENT EXISTING RESIDENCES.
UM, TOTAL IMPROVED SQUARE FEET ACCORDING TO HCAD.
UM, THE ONE ON THE LEFT IS EAST NORTH HILL.
THE ONE ON THE RIGHT IS NORTH NORTH HILL.
UM, THE DISTRIBUTION IS VERY SIMILAR, UM, BUT I JUST WANTED TO KIND OF SHOW YOU THAT HISTOGRAM, UM, WHERE YOU CAN SEE THAT THE MAJORITY OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD HAS A PRETTY TIGHT, UM, DISTRIBUTION OF SIZES.
UM, IF WE GO TO THE NEXT ONE, THIS IS A STATISTICAL TABLE OF SHOWING KIND OF THE LOT SIZES FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
SO YOU CAN SEE IN THE MIDDLE THERE THAT THE MAJORITY OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD ARE LOT SIZES BETWEEN 5,000 AND 6,000.
SO I'M GONNA KIND OF FOCUS ON THAT 'CAUSE THAT'S ABOUT 93% OF THE HOUSES WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
AND SO IF YOU GO TO THIS ONE, WHAT THIS IS IS THE NUMBER OF HOUSES THAT EXIST, UM, ABOVE THOSE SQUARE FOOTAGES FOR EACH RESIDENCE.
SO I TOOK OUT, UM, THOSE PROPERTIES WITHIN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT ARE COMMERCIAL.
UM, THESE ARE JUST RESIDENCES.
THIS IS THE PRIMARY RESIDENCE.
SO IT'S TAKING OUT IF THERE'S A SECONDARY RESIDENCE, WHICH DON'T, ARE NO LONGER ALLOWED IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD AS PER THE DEED RESTRICTIONS.
UM, BUT BASICALLY YOU CAN SEE HERE THAT THERE'S LESS THAN 5% OF THE HOUSES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD ARE ABOVE 2200 SQUARE FEET.
UM, IF YOU START TO GO UP, THAT NUMBER DECREASES.
UM, AT 2300 SQUARE FEET, WE'RE AT LESS THAN 3% OF THE HOUSES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
AT 2,400 SQUARE FEET WE'RE AT ABOUT TWO AND A HALF PERCENT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND AT 2,500 SQUARE FEET OR MORE, AT LESS THAN 2% OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
UM, I'VE WENT BACK AND LOOKED AT SOME OF THE THINGS THAT WERE APPROVED BEFORE.
UM, COMMISSIONER YAP, THANK YOU FOR NOTICING.
THE MASSING WAS TOO LARGE ON SOME OF THOSE PROPERTIES THAT WERE APPROVED.
UM, BUT AT 3000 SQUARE FEET, ONE OF THE HOMEOWNERS CLAIMED 80 PROPERTIES WERE AT THAT SIZE.
AND YOU CAN SEE FROM THIS THAT IT'S LESS THAN A 1%.
ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS OF THE SPEAKER, MR. YA? UM, I DO HAVE QUE A QUESTION.
CAN YOU PUT BACK YOUR SLIDE NUMBER ONE WITH THE HISTOGRAM? THAT WAS ALL LOT SIZES.
OH, THIS IS THIS, THIS IS A HISTOGRAM OF LOT SIZES, NOS, SORRY, THAT INCLUDES ALL LOT SIZES.
SO IT'S ALL THE, IT'S ALL THE RESIDENCES IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
THIS IS IMPROVED SQUARE FEET, BUT BY OF THE PRIMARY, I THINK, WAIT, WHAT IS IT? CAN YOU TELL ME WHAT THE, THIS IS IMPROVED SQUARE FEET.
WHAT ARE THE VERTICAL SCALE ON BOTH THE DIFFERENT NOLL HILLS? JUST
[00:55:01]
FOR ME TO APPRECIATE THAT.SO THE TOP OF THAT, THAT AXIS ON THE LEFT IS 80.
SO THE SQUARE FOOTAGE RANGE IS AT THE BOTTOM OF THE GRAPH.
THE SQUARE FOOTAGE IS AT THE BOTTOM AND IT GOES FROM, UM, 1000 ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE.
AND THEN RIGHT ABOUT THE, THE, YOU SEE HOW THERE'S SORT OF A TAIL, UM, WHERE THE BEGINNING OF THAT TAIL IS? IS THAT, YEAH, BUT 2070 5% PERCENTILE OF IT IS, IS BASICALLY ON, ON THIS LEFT HAND SIDE IS ABOUT 1500 OR MAYBE 1600 SQUARE FEET.
AND THEN THE ONE ON THE RIGHT IS ABOUT MAYBE 1700.
90 95% IS A, IS UNDER 1900 CURRENTLY.
UM, BUT THERE HAVE BEEN A FEW APPROVALS IN THE PAST YEAR OR SO THAT ARE, THAT ARE ABOVE OKAY.
SO MY SECOND QUESTION IS, CAN YOU PUT THE LAST SLIDE IN WITH THE SLIDING PERCENTAGES WHEN THE HOUSE SIZES GOT BIGGER? DO, DID YOU DIFFERENTIATE FROM THE HOUSE SIZES, WHETHER THEY WERE ORIGINALLY BUILT THAT SIZE OR THEY WERE ALREADY HAD A PREVIOUS ADDITION TO THAT SIZE? WE HAVE THAT DATA.
I HAVE A DIFFERENT SLIDE ON THAT.
UM, BUT AS FAR AS BY TIME PERSPECTIVE, SO THOSE EIGHT, THOSE FOUR SQUARES ARE, ARE ORIGINAL, SORRY, A LITTLE BIT DISCOMBOBULATED.
SORRY, I DIDN'T MEAN TO HIT YOU FROM THE LEFT FIELD, BUT I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT, UH, THAT WHAT I'M LOOKING IS ALL CONSISTENT.
SO WHAT THIS IS, IS IT'S THE SAME HISTOGRAM, BUT NOW IT'S GOING THROUGH, UM, GROUPED BY WHEN THE RENOVATION IN HC HCAD LAST APPEARED.
UM, SO THAT, THAT THERE'S A LITTLE BABY, HIS HISTORY, THERE'S A LITTLE, LITTLE SCATTERING AT THE TOP, BUT THE SECOND ROW IS BETWEEN 1980 AND A 99 RENOVATION.
UM, THE ONE BELOW THAT IS BETWEEN 2020 19.
AND THEN THERE'S ONE AT THE VERY BOTTOM THAT'S POST 2020.
PROGRESSIVELY THE ADDITIONS HAVE BEEN GETTING BIGGER AND BIGGER.
AND THAT'S THE REASON FOR THE GUIDELINES.
AND WE'RE GETTING NEIGHBORHOOD FEEDBACK OF WHAT PEOPLE ARE COMFORTABLE WITH IS HOW BIG IS, ARE PEOPLE COMFORTABLE WITH.
UM, I JUST, I JUST WANTED TO BRING IT TO YOUR ATTENTION THAT THERE'S AN IMPLICATION FOR A 3000 SQUARE FOOT HOUSE RIGHT NOW.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR THANK YOU GUYS.
GOT TWO SPEAKER, TWO MORE QUESTIONS.
SO MR. CO, FIRST, WELL, I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS FOR YOU OR ROMAN, WHAT STAGE ARE THE DESIGN GUIDELINES IN FOR NOR HILL DANA KNOW AS WELL AS I DO
AND DO THE PROPOSED GUIDELINES HAVE FAR CALCULATIONS IN THEM AND LOT.
SO, SO SOME OF THIS WILL BE ADDRESSED AS SOON AS THE DESIGN GUIDELINES? IT IS.
I'M JUST, WHICH WILL LIMIT THE SIZE OF THE PROPOSED POSITION.
YEAH, THIS WAS MORE, YEAH, EXACTLY.
I THINK, NOT TO INTERRUPT YOU, I'M SORRY.
BUT THIS IS MORE TO, YOU KNOW, PROPERTIES THAT GO IN BEFORE THAT.
I THINK THE DESIGN GUIDELINES ARE THE WAY TO GO FOR MULTIPLE REASONS.
BUT I JUST WANTED TO BE AWARE THAT, YOU KNOW, IF THERE'S A PANIC AND YOU KNOW, YOU GET FOUR, FOUR OR FIVE 3000 SQUARE FOOT HOUSES, THERE'S A REASON FOR THAT.
'CAUSE THE DEBATE RIGHT NOW IS, DOES IT HAVE TO BE 2300 SQUARE FEET OR IS IT 1900 SQUARE FEET? NO ONE'S SAYING 3000 RIGHT NOW.
OH, I, I WAS GONNA ASK BASICALLY THE SAME QUESTION, BUT I HAVE A QUESTION MAYBE MORE FOR ROMAN.
DO WE HAVE ANY UPDATE ON OTHER HISTORIC DISTRICTS THAT ARE MISSING THEIR DESIGN GUIDELINES? IF THERE'S ANY PROGRESS TOWARDS CREATING 'EM? 'CAUSE SINCE WE'VE GOTTEN THE ONE FOR THE HEIGHTS, IT'S BEEN REALLY HELPFUL AND WE HAVE SOME OTHER TRICKY NEIGHBORHOODS THAT WOULD REALLY BENEFIT FROM REAL DESIGN GUIDELINES.
RIGHT NOW WE'RE TRYING TO GET THESE TO YOU AS A STAFF AND, UM, YOU KNOW, WE, AND SO AS SOON AS, UM, WE'RE WRAPPING THESE UP SCREEN, WE WILL, WE WILL JUMP BACK TO CAMERA OFF, UH, WOODLAND HEIGHTS.
SO THIS, THIS, THIS SET FOR NOR HILL AND THE SET FOR WOODLAND HEIGHTS AND THE SET FOR OLD SIX WARD, WE HAVE A GOOD STRONG, WELL, LET'S JUST SAY WE HAVE AN OUTLINE FOR, BECAUSE
[01:00:01]
WIND AND COMPANY, NORA WIND AND COMPANY WORKED ON THOSE.SO THAT'S WHERE WE WOULD GO TO NEXT BECAUSE IT'S STILL FRESH ON AMANDA.
I MEAN, SHE'S JUST DOING TERRIFIC, TERRIFIC WORK.
AND SHE'S BEEN ALONG FOR THE RIDE SINCE WINTER STARTED IN WHATEVER, 2016 OR SOMETHING.
SO, UM, WE WANT TO GET WOODLAND AND OH SIX WARD THROUGH NEXT.
AND THEN I THINK IF I'M JUST INTUITIVELY SPEAKING RIGHT OFF THE CUFF, I THINK WE'D MOVE TO GLEN BROOK VALLEY BECAUSE OF, BECAUSE OF SO MANY WHAT'S WORK THERE.
AND, BUT, UM, THE OTHER THING THAT WE ALSO HAVE, UM, AVONDALE, UH, EAST AND WEST AND FORMER COMMISSIONER, NO, NOT FORMER COMM.
WHAT AM I SAYING? OH MY GOODNESS, THAT'S NOT RIGHT.
COMMISSIONER CHUCK STAAVA, WHO'S NOT HERE TODAY FOR, UH, OR IS HE ONLINE? HE'S VIRTUAL.
THERE IS, COMMISSIONER STAVE IS ONLINE, AND, UM, HAVING HIM IN, UH, AVONDALE EAST AND WEST IS A GREAT TERRIFIC RESOURCE.
AND I KNOW HE WOULD HELP US TO PASS TO, TO, TO, TO DRAFT AND WORK WITH THE COMMUNITY TO DRAFT DESIGN GUIDELINES FOR THAT, THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS TOO.
ROMAN, IS IT FAIR TO SAY THAT, UM, THE GUIDELINES THAT WERE CREATED IN THE HEIGHTS, FOR INSTANCE, AND THEN WHICH ALSO THEN LED TO THE, THE, THE FRONT END DOCUMENTS FOR THESE OTHER DISTRICTS THAT YOU'VE MENTIONED, LIKE, LIKE NOR HILL, UM, THOSE WERE PAID FOR BY SOME MONEY THAT WAS RAISED THROUGH SOME SALE HISTORIC PROPERTIES.
UM, BUT THAT WAS A LIMITED AMOUNT OF FUNDING.
BUT WHAT, WHAT MY UNDERSTANDING RIGHT NOW IS YOU, YOU ALL AS STAFF ARE TRYING TO TIE THESE UP, BUT YOU'RE DOING IT WITHIN, ON YOUR OWN STAFF TIME, ALONG WITH ALL THE OTHER WORK YOU'RE DOING.
SO PART OF THIS IS, YOU'RE RIGHT, BECAUSE THERE'S A LACK OF FUNDING FOR YES THERE, THAT FUNDING SOURCE WAS FINITE AND NOT, NOT, UH, IT, IT WASN'T VERY EXPANSIVE.
SO YOU'RE TRYING TO WRAP THIS UP AND THAT PROBABLY HAS ALSO WHY THIS HAS TAKEN A LITTLE BIT LONGER THAN RIGHT.
IS THAT FAIR TO SAY? OR IS THAT THAT'S ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.
WE, AND, AND I'VE, I REALLY FEEL WE HAVE THE STAFF TO DO IT.
UH, WE'RE, YOU KNOW, IT'S TERRIFIC, REALLY.
I WELCOME THE OPPORTUNITY TO WORK ON THESE.
I WOULD PREFER NOT TO HAVE A CONSULTANT WORKING ON THEM.
WE HAVE SO MUCH GREAT TALENT TO PULL FROM WITH YOU GUYS, WITH OUR STAFF, WITH PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY.
AND, UH, YOU KNOW, THE COMMISSIONERS LIKE, I MEAN, CHUCK STOPS TERRIFIC RESOURCE AND, UM, SO, BUT YES, WE DON'T WANNA SPEND ANY, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE MONEY, ANY MONEY LEFT IN THE PRESERVATION FUNDS SPENT ON BRICK AND MORTAR WORK.
I DON'T WANT TO, I PERSONALLY HOPE THAT WE, WHATEVER IS LEFT AND WHATEVER MIGHT COME INTO THAT FUND IN THE FUTURE, UH, COULD BE, UM, UTILIZED IN DIFF DIFFERENT WAY AND MORE BRICK AND MORTAR HELP.
WELL, ROMAN, I, I HEAR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING AND I THINK, UM, THE STAFF IS, IS VERY STRONG RIGHT NOW.
UM, YOU KNOW, WE'VE, WE'VE BEEN THROUGH PERIODS WHERE, WHERE, UM, WHERE, WHERE THAT WAS CHALLENGING.
BUT, UM, I THINK I SEE AN URGENCY IN DESIGN GUIDELINES.
UM, WE HAVE 23, HOW MANY HISTORIC DISTRICTS NOW? SO, UM, 23.
I MEAN, IS THAT SOMETHING THAT STAFF CAN HANDLE ALONG WITH THE MONTHLY WORKLOAD AND RESPONSE? UM, OR, YES.
I, I GUESS MY, MY QUESTION BEFORE YOUR LAST COMMENT WAS, IS THERE A, AN ESTIMATE THAT YOU COULD THROW OUT OF WHAT, UM, I MEAN, DESIGN GUIDELINES FROM START TO FINISH, IS THAT A $50,000 PROJECT? IS THAT A $5,000 PROJECT? UH, NO, I COULDN'T, I COULDN'T GUESS ON THAT.
BUT TO THE FIRST QUESTION, TO TWO PART QUESTION, CAN STAFF TO ASSURE WE'RE ABOUT TO WRAP UP OR WE'RE ABOUT TO START TO IMPLEMENT THE NEW, UM, UH, TOOL FOR SUBMITTING APPLICATIONS THAT REPLACE HISTORIC PRESERVATION TRACKER? MM-HMM
WE, I STRONGLY SUSPECT THAT WILL MAKE US MUCH MORE EFFICIENT IN THE OFFICE.
AND HOPEFULLY THERE'LL BE OTHER THINGS THAT WILL MAKE US MORE EFFICIENT, BUT GET, I JUST DO THINK WE HAVE THE, WE DO HAVE THE TAB, THE STAFF AND THE TALENT AND WE CAN DO IT.
I THINK WE CAN WORK THROUGH, I MEAN, BY THE TIME, YOU KNOW HOW THE CITY PROBABLY, IF WE DID HAVE ANY MONEY, WE WANTED TO HIRE CONSULTANTS, BY THE TIME WE GET A CONSULTANT ON BOARD, WE'LL GET ANOTHER COUPLE DONE.
UM, WELL I WAS WONDERING IF, IF, UM, INDIVIDUAL NEIGHBORHOODS OR DISTRICTS WERE, UH, WILLING OR INTERESTED, UM, IN KIND OF JUMPING THE LINE THERE, IF THERE WAS A, A KIND OF FEE FOR SERVICE THING, UM, THAT EITHER THE OFFICE COULD DO OR, YOU KNOW, THAT A NEIGHBOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD COULD WORK ON RAISING THOSE FUNDS.
UM, I KNOW THERE ARE THE OTHER DISTRICTS AND WE HAVE, AND WE CAN SEE WHERE WE'RE GOING.
UM, I, I JUST THINK WE OUGHT TO JUST KEEP IT IN-HOUSE AND, AND, AND DO IT.
AND, AND, AND, AND WITH THE EFFICIENCY, A LITTLE
[01:05:01]
MORE EFFICIENCY.AND, UH, TERRANCE JACKSON'S DOING PHENOMENAL JOB MANAGING THIS PROCESS AND WORKING WITH AMANDA.
AND ALSO, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE GET TO CITY COUNCIL, I MEAN, YOU GUYS ARE EASY ON US ON THE DESIGN GUIDELINES, BUT WE GOTTA GET THIS TO CITY COUNCIL.
AND I SUSPECT THERE WILL BE PEOPLE WHO WILL COME AND COMPLAIN ABOUT THOSE GUIDELINES WHO DON'T EVEN LIVE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OR WHO THINK THAT WE'RE ADDING ADDITIONAL RESTRICTIONS OR SOMETHING.
AND SO BY US, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE, YOU KNOW, KIND OF PAID TO DO, IS TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO MAKE THINGS WORK AND GET TO CITY COUNCIL AND HAVE THE CITY COUNCIL, UM, YOU KNOW, AS, AS, AS PREPARED FOR THE DECISION AS THEY CAN BE.
AND TO THE EXTENT YOU BRING AN OUTSIDE CONSULTANT, AND MANY OF THEM USUALLY ARE GONNA BE OUT OF TOWN PEOPLE.
THEY'RE GONNA FLY IN ONCE IN A WHILE.
AND, UH, THOSE THINGS, AND THERE'S A NEW ERA I THINK I'VE SENSED IN THE TERMS OF CREATING A DISTRICT OR CREATING ANYTHING WHERE YOU NEED A LOT MORE BUY-IN.
IT SEEMS LIKE THE IMPACT OF TECHNOLOGY AND SOCIAL MEDIA AND TEXTING AND GROUPS IS JUST, IT, IT MAKES, UM, IT CAN MAKE THINGS MOVE ALONG MORE SMOOTHLY, BUT IT CAN ALSO MAKE A, A, A, A, A, A MINORITY, A SMALL MINORITY, BE MUCH MORE VERY VOCAL.
SO IT, I I FEEL LIKE REALLY GIVEN THE TALENT THAT THE CITY OF HOUSTON HAS ALLOWED US TO HIRE SOME PEOPLE AND HOPEFULLY THIS GOOD, GREAT TEAM WILL STAY WITH US TOGETHER.
ROMAN AM I, I I JUST HAVE A QUESTION OR KIND OF AN OBSERVATION.
'CAUSE WE, AS COMMISSION MEMBERS, WE DON'T MAKE GUIDELINES, YOU KNOW, WE'RE, WE, WE CAN ATTEND A PUBLIC MEETING AS A MEMBER REALLY, I GUESS, OF THE PUBLIC, YOU KNOW, AT SOME POINT, ONCE THERE'S ENOUGH PUBLIC IN, UH, INTERACTION AND INPUT, A A RECOMMENDATION COMES BEFORE THIS BODY TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION WHETHER TO SEND IT ON TO CITY COUNCIL OR NOT.
BUT MY, SO, SO AS A, AS A CITIZEN, WHAT I WOULD SAY IS, AS SOMETHING ON THE SIDELINES, YOU KNOW, WHAT I'VE SEEN, LIKE WITH NOR HILL AND SOME OF THESE OTHER DISTRICTS, WHICH ARE UP TO BAT RIGHT NOW, MUCH OF THIS WAS SORT OF SET WITH THE TEMPLATE OF THE HEIGHTS DISTRICTS THAT WERE CREATED.
BUT MANY OF THESE OTHER DISTRICTS, WHILE THEY'RE SIMILAR, ARE NOT THE SAME LIKE NOEL, WHICH, LIKE, LIKE WE SAW TODAY, THE VAST NUMBER OF PROPERTIES ARE SMALLER THAN SAY MANY OF THE HOMES, LIKE IN SOME OF THE HEIGHTS DISTRICTS THAT HAVE DEED RESTRICTIONS.
SO JUST APPLYING ONE BLANKET RESTRICTION OR, OR GUIDELINES TO ALL THESE DISTRICTS, I THINK IS WHAT I HAVE SEEN THIS PROCESS SLOW DOWN AND TRY TO HAVE MORE MEETINGS WITH THE PUBLIC TO MAKE SURE THAT THESE INDIVIDUAL GUIDELINES IN A GIVEN DISTRICT MEET THE SUPPORT OF THE PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY LIVE IN THOSE DISTRICTS.
AND THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT I'VE OBSERVED, I GUESS.
AND SO I THINK THAT MY, MY, MY SENSE IS THAT WHAT COMES OUT OF THIS PROCESS WILL BE A BETTER RESULT THAN WOULD'VE, WOULD'VE HAPPENED IF THEY WERE RUSHED THROUGH JUST USING THE OTHER TE TEMPLATE AS FOR EVERYONE, IS THAT, YES, THAT'S AN OBSERVATION, BUT THAT'S MY NO, THAT'S EXACTLY RIGHT.
AND IT'S GONNA BE A SHORTER DOCUMENT.
YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE DOCUMENT ALREADY THAT WE'LL BRING ON NOR HILL IS, I DON'T KNOW HOW, JUST LIKE A THIRD OF THE LENGTH OF THE OTHER DOCUMENT, BECAUSE I'LL JUST LEAVE IT THERE.
IT'LL BE SHORTER AND IT'LL, IT'LL HAVE WHAT, WHAT WE NEED TO GET WORK DONE.
THE, UM, YEAH, THAT, THAT'S RIGHT.
WE WORK CLOSER WITH THE PEOPLE.
AND AGAIN, I WANT TO THANK, UH, NOR HILL AND TERRANCE AND ALSO TWO DATES, UH, IN CASE YOU WANT TO ATTEND, WE WILL BE MEETING WITH THE NOR HILL NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION WELL WITH, WELL WITH, WE ARE INVITING THE ENTIRE NEIGHBORHOOD.
WE WILL HAND DELIVER AN INVITATION TO EACH HOUSE IN NOR HILL TO ATTEND TWO UPCOMING MEETINGS.
THEY CAN CHOOSE ONE OR THE OTHER.
AND THE DATES FOR THOSE MEETINGS, UH, UH, 27TH, THE 27TH OF FEBRUARY, AND THE 5TH OF MARCH, THE 27TH OF FEBRUARY, AND THE 5TH OF MARCH, WE'LL BE MEETING AT THE REC CENTER ON THE NORTH SIDE.
MONTY BEACH, THE MONTY BEACH REC CENTER.
UH, PLEASE CALENDAR IT AND IF YOU WANT, WE CAN JUST SEND IT TO YOU.
BUT, YOU KNOW, JUST YOU COULD SIT IN THE AUDIENCE AND KIND OF HEAR TOO, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S GOING ON.
WAIT, LEGAL, JUST SHUT ME DOWN ON THAT.
I JUST A COUPLE OF COMMENTS SINCE PLEASE, KIM.
AND, YOU KNOW, WE'VE BEEN WORKING WITH STAFF ON DESIGN GUIDELINES SINCE THE DISTRICTS, SINCE THE HEIGHTS DISTRICTS.
AND, UM, I, I KNOW THEY'RE, THEY'RE WORKING TO GET EVERYTHING YOU WANT ACCOMPLISHED, ACCOMPLISHED.
UM, A COUPLE OF, JUST A COUPLE OF THINGS TO BEAR IN MIND.
I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, COMING UNDER CHAPTER TWO 11 MEANS WE HAVE TO CONSIDER WHAT THE, UH, PROCEDURAL REQUIREMENTS OF STATE LAW NOW REQUIRE, UM, WITH ADOPTION OF THESE KINDS OF, OF GUIDELINES.
AND, AND WE'LL, WE'LL LOOK TO SEE HOW THAT FITS IN BEST.
UM, IF YOU DO PLAN TO ATTEND THE MEETING IN NOR HILL, OR, OR IF YOU THINK ANY OF YOU THINK
[01:10:01]
YOU MIGHT, WE SHOULD PROBABLY POST IT AS A PUBLIC MEETING WITH THE CAVEAT.AND I CAN WORK WITH STAFF THAT A, YOU KNOW, A QUORUM OR MORE OF THE COMMISSION MIGHT SHOW UP BECAUSE THIS IS SOMETHING THAT YOU ALL WILL BE HEARING AND TAKING ACTION ON AT SOME FUTURE MEETING.
AND SO, UM, TO THE EXTENT, I DON'T EXPECT YOU TO SIT THERE WITH A GAG OVER YOUR MOUTH, UM, BUT, YOU KNOW, TO THE EXTENT WE DO THAT, THEN I WANT, I WANNA MAKE SURE WE CAN COMPLY WITH THE OPEN MEETINGS LAW.
I'LL WORK WITH STAFF TO MAKE SURE WE JUST POST IT THAT WAY, JUST IN THE EVENTUALITY YOU ALL DECIDE TO COME.
UH, CAN I, CAN I GET FURTHER CLARIFICATION FROM, UM, MISS MICKELSON, SO WE CAN ATTEND AS MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC AND MAKE COMMENTS AS LONG AS YOU FEEL THAT WE, IT'S BEING MENTIONED THAT, THAT IT'S, THAT IT'S A PUBLIC MEETING OR WE ARE NOT ALLOWED TO COMMENT IN ANY WAY OR FASHION.
IT'S NOT ABOUT ME, IT'S ABOUT THE TEXAS OPEN MEETINGS ACT AND THE TEXAS OPEN MEETINGS ACT STIPULATES THAT I MEET THAT WHERE A QUORUM OR MORE OF THE MEMBERS OF THIS ORGANIZATION GATHER TO AND, AND COMMENT OR DISCUSS I ITEMS THAT WILL COME BEFORE THEM AT SOME POINT IN TIME.
IT NEEDS TO BE POSTED AS AN OPEN MEETING.
I ALWAYS DO THIS IN THE EVENT THAT MAYBE IT'S ONLY TWO OF YOU WHO SHOW UP, BUT I'D RATHER ERR ON THE SIDE OF CAUTION THAT IT'S POSTED.
AND THAT WAY YOU CAN COMMENT FREELY.
YOU DON'T, WE DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT IT.
I DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT YOU GUYS GETTING IN TROUBLE.
IS THERE AN ISSUE, MAY I ASK, BETWEEN IF MR. YAP WERE TO SPEAK OR ATTEND A MEETING, IS HE A COMMISSIONER OR IS HE A CITIZEN OR IS HE BOTH, I MEAN, DOES IT MATTER AT THAT POINT? WELL, TECHNICALLY HE'S BOTH, BUT HE IS, HE IS AN OFFICER UNDER THE TEXAS OPEN MEETINGS ACT.
ALL OF YOU ARE PUBLIC OFFICIALS.
AND SO THAT MEANS THAT WE HAVE TO ABIDE BY THAT AND HAVE THAT IN THE BACK OF OUR MIND.
UM, IF YOU SPEAK, YOU MAY GET UP AND SAY, I'M SPEAKING AS A, AS A PRIVATE INDIVIDUAL, NOT AS A COMMISSIONER, BUT MY, SORRY, MY, THE NUANCE OF MY QUESTION IS IT'S DIFFERENT FROM THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT.
IT'S, I'VE ALWAYS SORT OF UNDERSTOOD THAT THE COMMISSION DOESN'T MAKE GUIDELINES.
WE, WE OBSERVE, WE, WE, WE MAKE OURSELVES AWARE, BUT, AND AT SOME POINT WE'RE GOING TO REVIEW WHAT COMES OF ALL THIS, RIGHT.
BUT GENERALLY SPEAKING, WE'VE, WE'VE NOT, IN MY, MY MEMORIES, WE'VE NOT PLAYED AN ACTIVE ROLE IN THE FRONT END OF MAKING GUIDELINES.
IT'S NOT UNTIL WE, THERE'S A LOT OF INFORMATION FROM THE PUBLIC ABOUT, AND THEN WE HAVE TO WEIGH WHAT, 'CAUSE INFORMATION COMES FROM DIFFERENT VOICES, OBVIOUSLY, BUT WE HAVEN'T, WE HAVEN'T LIKE BEEN MAKING THEM ON THE FRONT END, AS I CAN RECALL.
WE'VE BEEN OBSERVING, GOING TO MEETINGS, SO WE'RE AWARE OF WHAT'S BEING DISCUSSED.
AND THEN, AND THEN ONCE IT COMES TO US, THEN WE HAVE DISCUSSIONS AND WE MAKE SUGGESTIONS, BUT WE WAIT UNTIL THE PUBLIC STARTS THAT PROCESS, IS IT.
AND SO, UNLESS, UNLESS WE SPEAK AS A CITIZEN AT THOSE MEETINGS, AND THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT'S THE NATURE OF MY QUESTION IN TERMS OF THERE, THERE, THERE REALLY IST A SEPARATION IN YOUR MIND LEGALLY.
I I'M GONNA, YEAH, I'M GONNA, I I'M GONNA, I'M GONNA RECOMMEND THAT WE ERR ON THE SIDE OF CAUTION.
UM, IT'S, IT'S MAYBE A MORE CONSERVATIVE VIEW.
MY RECOLLECTION, I WAS OUTSIDE COUNSEL WHEN WE DID THE WORK FOR, UM, THE HEIGHTS HISTORIC DISTRICT'S GUIDELINES.
AND MY RECOLLECTION THEN WAS THAT, THAT THE LEGAL DEPARTMENT STAFF TOOK THAT SAME POSITION.
UM, IT'S MUCH SAFER FOR US TO POST IT AS A, AS THE FACT THAT A POSSIBLE QUORUM MAY ATTEND.
UM, AS I SAY, EVEN IF ONLY ONE OF YOU ATTENDS, AND THEN YOU MAY SPEAK AND YOU MAY SAY, I'M SPEAKING AS A PRIVATE CITIZEN, BUT, UM, I THINK THAT COVERS ALL THE GROUNDS.
IT'S, IT'S, IT DOESN'T CHANGE WHAT YOU DO OR CAN'T DO AT THAT MEETING, IT JUST IS IS IT MAKES IT COMPLY WITH THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT.
I, I'VE JOB, BUT THAT'S NOT MY QUESTION.
MY QUESTION IS, CAN COMMISSION MEMBERS ATTEND A MEETING THAT HAS BEEN POSTED AND HAVE CONVERSATIONS REPRESENTING THE COMMISSION? OR IS IT REALLY, ARE THEY MEANT TO BE JUST PUBLIC CITIZENS IN THOSE EARLY PUBLIC MEETINGS? THAT THAT'S, I I, I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU DRAW THE LINE IN A, IN A WHOLE CONVERSATION OF, AM I HERE AS A PRIVATE CITIZEN OR AM I HERE AS A COMMISSION? OKAY, SO, SO WE CAN BE, AS LONG AS IT'S POSTED, WE CAN BE BOTH.
I, I THINK THAT'S MY QUESTION.
I THINK YOU'RE WEARING BOTH HATS.
THAT HELPS ME WAY APPROACH IT.
[01:15:01]
SO IF I WANT TO ATTEND A NOR HILL MEETING, WHO DO I NEED TO REPORT TO? I TO, TO, UH, ROMAN'S OFFICE AND SLASH I THINK AT THIS, I THINK AT THIS POINT, I JUST ANSWERED THE QUESTION TO MYSELF THAT WHEN I SAID IT FIRST, PLEASE LET STAFF KNOW.AND THEN I KIND OF WENT FURTHER.
WE WILL WORK WITH STAFF TO JUST MAKE SURE IT'S POSTED THAT WAY.
SO I, ON THE POSS, YOU DON'T HAVE TO TELL ANY OF US.
YOU'RE GONNA POST IT ON THE POSSIBILITY THAT WE WOULD BE THERE AS, UH, UH, IN SUFFICIENT QUANTITY TO BE A QUORUM.
SO THAT IS MY CONCERN IN TERMS OF THE OPEN, UH, THAT IS MY CONCERN.
AND JUST BECAUSE A QUORUM OF YOU IS THERE, DOESN'T MEAN YOU NEED TO ALL, YOU DON'T NEED TO CALL A MEETING TO ORDER.
IT JUST COVERS YOU THAT WE MIGHT HAVE A MEETING.
SO, YEAH, SO, SO PLEASE, YEAH, DISREGARD MY FIRST COMMENT COMMISSIONER APP ABOUT CALLING UP STAFF TO LET THEM KNOW, BECAUSE THEN THEY'LL HAVE TO TRACK IT, BUT WE'LL JUST POST IT THAT WAY.
SO MR. CHAIR, I DO ACTUALLY HAVE A QUESTION.
ACTUALLY, FOR, FOR ROMAN, ACTUALLY, FOLLOWING ON FROM WHAT, UH, COMMISSIONER JACKSON HAS MENTIONED, UH, IS THERE A, A, UM, OBJECTIVE GOAL AT THE END? LIKE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE LIKE AT LEAST 23 TO 26 HISTORIC DISTRICTS, AND AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, ONLY THREE OF THEM HAS BEEN RESOLVED.
THE HEIGHTS EAST AND EAST AND WEST HAS BEEN, HAS DESIGN GUIDELINES.
DO YOU HAVE A STEADY, UH, TIMEFRAME TO SAY THAT WE NEED TO GET ONE GUIDELINE PER QUARTER COMPLETED? BECAUSE, UM, I HAVE BEEN HERE FOR MAYBE A YEAR PLUS NOW BEEN LISTENING TO THE FACT THAT THERE, THERE IS THIS THING GOING ON, DESIGN GUIDELINES BEING DONE FOR WOODLAND HEIGHTS SLASH NOR HILL, BUT I THINK FOR ABOUT AT LEAST EIGHT, NINE MONTHS NOW, THIS IS STILL RIGHT NOW AT THE REVIEW STAGE WITH THE PUBLIC.
SO DO WE HAVE A FIRM DEADLINE TO SAY, OKAY, FINISH THAT ONE AND THEN NEXT ONE IS IN ANOTHER THREE MONTHS FROM NOW, EVERY THREE MONTHS WE GET ONE OUT.
IS THERE A TIMEFRAME LIKE THAT? NO, AND THERE'S A REASON FOR THAT.
LIKE WE, WITH NOR HILL ONCE, WE JUST RECENTLY STARTED WHEN WE WERE, WHEN WE REALLY REACTIVATED, THIS FEELS LIKE A YEAR AGO OR SO, EIGHT, NINE MONTHS AGO.
AND THEN, UM, YOU HAVE TO, TO ME, WITH SOMETHING LIKE THIS, YOU JUST HAVE TO WEIGH THE PUBLIC INPUT.
NOR HILL NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION, THE BOARD IS VERY ACTIVE AND THEN THE NEIGHBORHOOD IS BEING REDEVELOPED INTENSIVELY.
THERE'S JUST A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT HAVE AN INTEREST, A LOT OF STAKEHOLDERS.
SO THAT'S WHY WE'RE HAVING TWO IDENTICAL MEETINGS.
I MEAN, WE MAY COME FORWARD AND MEET WITH THE OLD SIX WARD NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION AT, YOU KNOW, TOWARDS THE END OF WRAPPING THIS ONE UP.
AND WE MAY FIND THAT OUR DRAFT, BY THE WAY, THEY ALREADY HAVE DESIGN GUIDELINES.
THERE ARE TO HELP ME TEAM MAYBE TWO OR THREE OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS WITH DESIGN GUIDELINES.
THEY'RE JUST SIX AND WOODLAND HEIGHTS, SORRY, ONE MORE TIME.
NO, SIX DO, HAVE, DO HAVE SOME GUIDELINES.
THEY'RE NOT AS TIGHT AS WHAT WE WERE DOING HERE.
SO IT WOULD BE HARD FOR ME TO PREDICT THAT BECAUSE I THINK WE JUST, AND THIS IS A GOOD EXPERIENCE.
PERHAPS WE COULD HAVE THAT CONVERSATION ONCE WE GET THIS DRAFT TO YOU.
UM, YOU KNOW, AND WE'LL HAVE TO MEET THE LEGAL REQUIREMENTS, WHICH IS WE'VE GOTTA INVITE THE WHOLE NEIGHBORHOOD HERE.
SO WE, OUR, IT'S OUR IDEA TO HOLD A SPECIAL HHC MEETING FOR THAT BECAUSE IT COULD BE A LOT OF SPEAKERS.
AND THEN, AND I THINK AT THAT POINT WE'LL HAVE A REALLY GOOD SENSE OF WHAT IT WILL TAKE.
THIS IS ALSO ONE OF THE LARGER NEIGHBORS, OUR 800 HOMES OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
IT'S A PRETTY, PRETTY BIG NEIGHBORHOOD IS A, COMPARED TO SOME OF THE OTHERS.
OLD SIX WARD, I DON'T REMEMBER THE SIZE, BUT IT'S A LOT LESS.
I I WOULD JUST, WE CAN, WE COULD WORK ON THAT KIND OF THING, BUT I THINK I WOULD BE A, I JUST WOULDN'T WANT TO COMMIT TO, YOU KNOW, WELL IT'S GONNA HAPPEN THAT SMOOTHLY.
AND ALSO GOT, I WANNA SEE WHAT HAPPENS AT CITY COUNCIL THAT TEACHES US SOMETHING DIFFERENT.
I MEAN, IT'S, IT'S A, IT WILL BE A BALANCING ACT, BUT I SENSE URGENCY IN GETTING THESE DESIGN GUIDELINES DONE AND THIS MM-HMM
RESPECTFULLY TO EVERYONE IN THE ROOM HAS TAKEN TOO LONG.
SO THERE IS PUBLIC MEETING THERE.
CERTAINLY THERE HAS TO BE PUBLIC INPUT.
THAT IS THE, THE, YOU KNOW, THE BASIS OF THESE.
BUT THE PROCESS NEEDS TO MOVE ALONG.
WE CAN'T PLEASE EVERY SINGLE PROPERTY OWNER OUT THERE OR HEAR FROM EVERY SINGLE PROPERTY OWNER IF THEY'RE NOT GOING TO COME, YOU KNOW, WHEN THE OPPORTUNITIES ARE THERE.
I MEAN, WE, IF, IF WE'VE GOT THREE OR FOUR NOW AND WE'VE GOT 20 MORE TO GO, I MEAN, THERE IS REAL URGENCY, UM, IN THESE MEETINGS EACH MONTH WITH, YOU KNOW, MISUNDERSTANDING AND, AND CLAIMS FOR HARDSHIPS THAT, THAT
[01:20:01]
DON'T HAVE TO EXIST IF WE HAVE A DOCUMENT THAT WE CAN POINT FOLKS TO.WELL, IT, IT'S VERY IMPORTANT FOR US TOO.
SO I THINK WE, WE WENT FROM, UH, COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC AND WE MOVED INTO COMMENTS FROM THE HAC.
I'M GONNA ASSU MAKE THAT ASSUMPTION.
ARE THERE ANY OTHER COMMENTS FROM THE COMMISSION MEMBERS? AND IF NOT, ROMAN, DO YOU HAVE A FLOOR WITH YOUR, YOUR DI DIRECTOR'S REPORT? OKAY, WELL THANKS FOR GETTING THROUGH THOSE ITEMS TODAY.
SO, UH, THE, THE DI DIRECTOR, UH, ALREADY MENTIONED THE MARCH 23RD CAMP TRAINING.
UM, I WANNA SAY THAT WE ACTUALLY HAVEN'T NAILED DOWN THE LOCATION FOR THAT.
AND I SENT OUT SOME EMAILS TO Y'ALL.
UM, THERE'S A, I THINK IT'S THE BAYOU CITY ARTS FESTIVAL OR ONE OF THE ARTS FESTIVALS DOWNTOWN THAT WEEKEND.
WE HAD THOUGHT OF HAVING IT AT THE CONSERVANCY, BUT THAT WOULD BE A LOT OF TRAFFIC KIND OF RIGHT AROUND HERE AT THE TIME.
UM, THAT COULD BE A CHALLENGE FOR PARKING AND GETTING EVERYONE HERE.
SO WE'RE LOOKING AT, WE'LL BE LOOKING AT OTHER PLACES AND IF YOU HAVE ANY SUGGESTIONS WE'RE, WE WE'RE SAYING THAT, JUST TO BE CAREFUL THAT WE'D PROBABLY NEED TO GET 40 PEOPLE IN THERE JUST TO MAKE SURE WE HAVE ENOUGH, UM, ROOM.
AND THEN THE OTHER THING, SINCE WE'VE GOT THIS LITTLE BIT OF TIME, I, I, UH, I GOT AN EMAIL FROM, UH, PETE STOCKTON AND I, I'D LIKE TO SHARE IT WITH YOU.
AND I WANTED TO HEAR FROM YOU GUYS ABOUT THIS TOPIC, ESPECIALLY THE BUILDERS WHO, WHO, WHO ARE EXPERIENCED, WHO MAY BE, I'M NOT AWARE OF THIS ISSUE AS CLEAR AS PETE IS.
HE SAYS THAT THE WINDOWS, UH, HAVE BEEN AN ONGOING CONCERN, OF COURSE, IN, IN, UH, HISTORIC DISTRICTS.
AND THAT INSET AND RECESS WINDOWS ARE PROPER ON CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES.
OF COURSE, HE SAYS, HOWEVER, CURRENT INDUSTRY STANDARDS FOR NEW WINDOW CONSTRUCTION UTILIZE A NAIL FIN FOR INSTALLATION.
AND I THINK HE'S IMPLYING HERE THAT THAT'S BECOMING TOTALLY THE NORM.
AND BECAUSE HE SAYS THE NAIL FIN MOUNTS ON THE FACE OF THE WALL, WHICH WE KNOW PREVENTING A WINDOWS RECESS, MOST WINDOW MANUFACTURERS DO NOT MAKE A WINDOW SERIES WITHOUT A FIN, WHICH WAS NEWS TO ME.
THE ONLY WAY TO INSET THE WINDOWS WOULD BE TO REMOVE THE NAIL FIN.
AND THIS WOULD BE CONTRACT CONTRARY TO THE MANUFACTURER'S STANDARDS, INSTRUCTIONS, AND VOID A WARRANTY.
SO FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION IN ADDITIONS, HE DOESN'T CONSIDER A FIN MOUNTED WINDOW WOULD VIOLATE THE STANDARDS.
HE SAYS THIN MOUNT, THIN MOUNTED WINDOWS COULD BE SEEN AS A PRODUCT OF THEIR OWN TIME AND COULD SERVE TO DIFFERENTIATE AN ORIGINAL CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE FROM LATER EDITIONS.
AND HE SAYS, FINALLY, WE, I SUGGEST WE RESERVE INSET AND RECESSED QUOTES.
QUOTES THERE, QUOTES THERE, INSET AND RECESS, WINDOW SPECIFICATION, REPAIR AND REPLACEMENT OF EXISTING CONTRIBUTING WINDOWS THAT HAVE BEEN DAMAGED BEYOND REPAIR.
AND THESE SHOULD BE SPECIFIED AS REPLACEMENT WINDOWS.
SO I WANTED TO BRING THAT UP WITH YOU.
I HADN'T HAD TIME TO REALLY WORK THROUGH IT, BUT AS DESIGNERS AND ARCHITECTS, I KNOW SOME OF YOU AND YOU'RE WORKING IN THE FIELD, WHAT IF, IF YOU WANTED TO GIVE ME ANY THOUGHTS, PLEASE ABOUT THAT OR SOMETHING YOU WANT US TO BRING FORWARD ON THAT TOPIC? I THINK YOU CAN ORDER REPLACEMENT WINDOWS THAT DON'T HAVE NAIL FINS THAT ARE MADE FOR WHEN YOU TAKE OLD WINDOWS OUT, BECAUSE YOU CAN'T PUT WINDOWS WITH NAIL FINS IN A EXISTING OPENING.
'CAUSE YOU GOTTA TAKE THE EXTRA YEAR TRIM OFF.
AND NORMALLY YOU JUST DO IT FROM THE INSIDE.
SO I'VE ALWAYS, WE'VE DONE THIS, HAVE ORDERED REPLACEMENT, AND IT'S A SPECIAL CATEGORY, BUT ALMOST ALL THE COMPANIES HAVE 'EM.
SO I'M NOT SURE WHICH ONES HE'S TALKING ABOUT THAT HE'S JUST TALKING ABOUT FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION, FOR, FOR ADDITIONS.
YEAH, LIKE IF YOU'RE DOING AN ADDITION, IF YOU'RE DOING AN ADDITION, YOU HAVE, AND YOU'RE DOING A NEW CONSTRUCTION ADDITION TO, FOR THE COMMISSION TO SAY ALL THE WINDOWS HAVE TO BE INSET, RECESSED THAT THEN I'M REMOVING A FIN FROM A BRAND NEW WINDOW VIOLATING THE WARRANTY ON THE WINDOW.
BUT YOU COULD BUY A REPLACEMENT WINDOW FOR THIS SITUATION.
YEAH, YOU COULD, YOU CAN BUY A REPLACEMENT WINDOW AND PUT IT IN THE HOLE.
BUT YOU CAN BUY A REPLACEMENT WINDOW, PUT IT IN THE HOLE, BUT THEN YOU'RE NOT USING FLASHING TAPE AND YOU'RE NOT FLASHING THE WINDOW CORRECTLY ACCORDING TO ANYBODY'S GUIDELINES.
AND THE, AND THE WINDOW WILL BE VOIDED AND YOU'RE PUTTING IT INTO A NEW CONSTRUCTION WALL.
YOU'RE NOT PUTTING IT INTO A REMODEL.
WHAT DON'T YOU THINK? WE'LL GET PUSHBACK.
PEOPLE ARE GONNA WANT WINDOWS THAT MATCH.
THEY WANT THE WHOLE, THE, YOU KNOW, EVEN NEW IN A NEW, UM, WELL, MAYBE WE COULD OFFER THEM THE OPTION AND NOT TELL THEM THEY HAVE TO DO ONE OR THE OTHER.
BUT SAY IF YOU WANT TO USE MODERN WINDOWS ON A MODERN EDITION, YOU CAN, BUT YOU HAVE TO USE THE INSET ONES ON THE OLD PART OF THE HOUSE IF YOU WANT IT.
OR YOU CAN USE THE INSET ONES TO, TO BE CONSISTENT.
AND ALSO KNOW THAT A NEW CONSTRUCTION VINYL, A NEW CONSTRUCTION ALUMINUM
[01:25:01]
AND A NEW CONSTRUCTION WOOD WINDOW ARE ALL GONNA HAVE DIFFERENT THICKNESSES AND ALL APPEAR DIFFERENTLY.AND YOU COULD ALWAYS FUR IT OUT WITH A ONE BY FOUR AND THEN DO, OR ONE, YOU KNOW, AND THEN DO YOUR TRIM TO CREATE THE APPEARANCE.
BUT YOU'RE THICKENING UP THE WALL ASSEMBLY TO MAKE THE APPEARANCE.
BUT I, I, I AGREE WITH PETE, RIGHT? IF I'M DOING AN ADDITION, I WANNA BUY NEW WINDOWS WITH A NAILING FIN THAT I INSTALL PER MANUFACTURER'S GUIDELINES.
I'M ALSO MEETING WIND STANDARDS FOR CITY GUIDELINES, AND I'M FLASHING IT IN A WAY THAT I KNOW IT'S NOT GONNA LEAK.
WHEREAS IF I BUY A RETROFIT WINDOW WITH NO FINS AND I'M JUST PUTTING IT IN THE HOLE, I MEAN, THOSE ARE SCREWED THROUGH THE JAMS AND THERE'S LITERALLY NO FLASHING AROUND THEM OPENING MYSELF UP AS A BUILDER TO WARRANTY CLAIMS. BUT THERE'S NO FLASHING AROUND THE HISTORIC WINDOWS EITHER.
AND THEY'VE BEEN THERE FOR 150 YEARS.
I KNOW, BUT YOU GOT, WELL, DIFFERENT MATERIALS, DIFFERENT WALL ASSEMBLIES, THEY GOT MAGIC WOOD, DIFFERENT LAWYERS AND STUFF NOW, ALL OF THAT.
HAS IT, CAN I ASK A QUESTION? HAS THIS BEEN AN ISSUE ON ANY PROJECT? HAS ANYBODY BROUGHT THIS UP AT ANY POINT? UH, SO I MEAN, ARE WE JUST TALKING ABOUT, ARE WE JUST TRYING TO MAKE WE HAVE TIME, NEED TO CREATE PROBLEMS, A PROBLEM OUT OF SOMETHING THAT DOES NOT EXIST AS A PROBLEM? NO, I, I THINK WHAT PROMPTED THE EMAIL WAS A, UM, SITE, A HOME, A HOME WE WENT TO IN THE HEIGHTS, AND I BELIEVE IT WAS ON COLUMBIA STREET, I COULD THROW OUT THE ADDRESS, BUT IT MIGHT NOT BE RIGHT, BUT IT WAS 1420 SOMETHING.
AND, UM, THIS SITUATION THAT PETE IS TALKING ABOUT, AND IT WAS A NEW CONSTRUCTION HOME, BUT PETE IS SAYING THAT HE HAS SEEN MORE AND MORE OF THE WINDOWS WITH THE NAILING FIN BEING PUT IN, AND THEY'RE NOT IN SET AND RECESSED AND HE'S HAVING TO GO OUT THERE WHEN HE DOES HIS INSPECTIONS AND HE'S HAVING TO TALK TO THE, UH, SUPERINTENDENT AND, AND GIVING HIM A FIX.
AND, UM, THE BUILDERS ARE SAYING, WELL, THIS IS GONNA COST ME 50 GRAND, OR THIS IS GONNA COST ME 15 GRAND TO DO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.
SO I THINK WHEN PETE SENT THIS EMAIL, HE WAS MAINLY LOOKING FOR A SOLUTION AND TRYING TO LET YOU GUYS KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE FIELD.
UM, BECAUSE WE ARE SEEING MORE AND MORE, UM, ACTUALLY ONE OF THE PROJECTS THAT WAS ON CONSENT, THE CONSENT AGENDA, UH, THE GUY IS PROPOSING VINYL WINDOWS AND VINYL WINDOWS ARE BECOMING MORE AND MORE AND MORE AND MORE PREVALENT.
BUT THE WHOLE INSET AND RECESS THING IS BECOMING THE PROBLEM.
I THINK THEY'RE HAVING AN ISSUE.
WELL, THEY HAVEN'T FIGURED OUT HOW, HOW TO INSTALL THE INSET, INSTALL THE VINYL WINDOWS AND MAKE IT LOOK INSET AND RECESS.
AND THAT'S WHAT PETE IS SENDING THIS EMAIL TO.
BUT DON'T WE HAVE TO SUBMIT THIS WINDOW SPECIFICATIONS WHEN THEY DO THE C OF A? SO ARE THEY CHANGING THEM AFTER THEY SUBMIT THEM? YES, THEY DO.
WELL THEN, I MEAN, THAT'S, THAT'S THEIR, THEIR OWN PROBLEM.
THEY SHOULDN'T BE CHANGING STUFF.
IF THEY SUBMIT IT AND IT GETS APPROVED, LIKE WHY DOES PETE THINK THAT'S OKAY FOR THEM TO CHANGE IT? AND HE'S GONNA DO SOME WORK AROUND, RIGHT.
THEY SHOULD JUST REJECT IT AND MAKE 'EM CHANGE THE WINDOWS.
WE NEED THE DEFINITION OF INSET AND RECESS BEFORE THEY GO AND ORDER THEIR WINDOWS.
THAT'S UNDERSTAND WHY THERE'S A PROBLEM, BECAUSE WE'VE NEVER APPROVED IT AND PEOPLE ARE JUST GOING BEHIND US AND CHANGING THEM AND THEN SAYING, OH NO, IT'S TOO BAD, IT'S TOO LATE.
RIGHT? WHY IS THAT COMM COMMISSIONER COUCH? MAYBE I CAN HELP WITH THAT.
ALTHOUGH I'M THE ONE NOT FEELING THE BRUNT OF IT AS WELL.
UM, GEL WIND HAS RAISED THEIR PRICES FOUR TIMES IN 2023.
SO, AND THAT WAS WHAT HAS HAPPENED.
AND THEN THE MOST RECENT ONE WAS IN FEBRUARY THEY RAISED IT AGAIN.
AND NOT ONLY THAT, PREVIOUSLY THERE WERE, FOR, FOR EXAMPLE, THERE WAS SIGHTLINE 2,500 SERIES AND THERE WAS A SIDELINE SERIES.
NOW THEY HAVE EVEN REMOVED THE, THE 2,500 SERIES, WHICH WAS SLIGHTLY CHEAPER, BUT STILL WOOD WINDOWS, AND JUST WENT WITH THE SIDELINE SERIES, WHICH IS THE MORE EXPENSIVE SIDE.
SO NOW THEY KEEP ON RAISING PRICES AND THE SELECTION IS POORER.
SO WHAT I THOUGHT WAS A $12,000 BUDGET NOW IS 17,000 FOR THAT.
SO I'M GIVING YOU NOT AN EXCUSE, BUT REASON WHY BUILDERS SUDDENLY, OH MY GOD.
YOU KNOW, WELL, I GUESS THE THING IS, IF THEY'RE SPENDING SUCH A LONG TIME TO GET THE C OF A AND YOU HAVE TO MAKE A SPECIFICATION, THEY COULD DO A PRICING EXERCISE AT THAT POINT RATHER THAN WAIT UNTIL AFTER EVERYTHING'S APPROVED AND THEN REALIZE, OH, I, I JUST SPECIFIED THE CADILLAC OF WINDOWS AND IT'S TOO EXPENSIVE, AND THEN THE OWNER'S CRYING, SO THEN I'M GONNA CHANGE IT AND NOT EVEN TALK TO THEM ABOUT CHANGING IT AND THEN JUST HOPE MM-HMM
THAT PIZZA TOXIN THINKS IT'S OKAY.
SO SURE, ALL THE WINDOWS GOING UP IN PRICE, EVERYTHING IS INFLATION.
BUT I THINK IT'S ON THEM TO, TO FIGURE OUT IF THEY'RE PICKING OUT THE RIGHT WINDOW THAT'S GONNA WORK.
AND THEY SHOULDN'T HAVE TO BE ABLE TO PICK ONE AND THEN SAY, OH NO, THAT'S NOT REALLY THE ONE I WANTED TO DO.
I WANNA DO A DIFFERENT ONE NOW.
[01:30:01]
HAVE TO ASK, GET A REVISION TO THE C OF A OR SOMETHING.BUT THIS JUST, OH, 'CAUSE THE WINDOWS WENT UP, EVERYTHING'S GONE UP, NOT JUST WINDOWS.
I MEAN, I DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT ANYTHING BUT WOOD WINDOWS AND THEN I CAN GET IT DONE TO BE DONE OR RECESSED AND INSIDE I CAN BUY WATER TABLES, UH, TO FLASH THEM PROPERLY FROM GROGAN AND SO ON.
BUT THAT'S THE COST THAT YOU GO GOING IN.
WE'RE, WE'RE NOT TYPICAL BUILDERS WE'RE, BUT RUN OF THE MILL BUILDERS IS GONNA FACE WHAT, WHAT, UH, WHAT PETE STOCKTON IS FACING.
THEY WANT GO A, A VINYL ROUTE, AND THEREFORE MOST OF THEM HAVE FINS, UNFORTUNATELY.
BUT COMMISSIONER, IF I MAY JUST ADD ONE THING, ROMAN, WHAT I'VE SEEN IS PUT ASIDE THE FIN AND, AND WHAT THAT MEANS, BUT IT'S MANY OF THE VINYL WINDOWS THAT WE'RE NOW SEEING, THE UPPER SASH AND THE LOWER SASH ARE IN THE SAME LINE IN IN A SENSE.
THEY, THEY'RE NOT EVEN, THERE'S, THERE'S NO RECESS, YOU KNOW, NATURE TO IT.
ANY, AND, AND YET WHEN YOU LOOK AT LIKE COMMERCIAL BUILDINGS WITH THAT HAVE SYSTEMS LIKE ALUMINUM SYSTEMS THAT, THAT ARE ACTUALLY FIXED WINDOWS, BUT THEY HAVE TO, THEY LOOK LIKE THEY'RE DOUBLE HUNG.
THEY, THEY, YOU KNOW, THEY'VE ACTUALLY MADE STAGGER LIKE THEY, THEY'VE OFFSET SECTIONS.
SO THEY APPEAR TO HAVE THE SHADOW LINE THAT WE, THAT WE ARE ASKING FOR.
SO PART OF IT IS NOT JUST THE FIN CONVERSATION, IT'S JUST HAVING A CHEAPER WINDOW BECAUSE A LOT OF THE WINDOWS, IT IS NOT JUST, UM, VINYL, BUT I, I'VE, THERE'S BEEN SOME OTHER WINDOWS THAT WE, THAT HAVE COME BEFORE US THAT THE UPPER SASH AND THE LOWER SASH ARE ALSO, THEY'RE, THEY'RE, NOT ONLY ARE THEY FLUSH TO THE OUTSIDE, BUT THEY'RE ALSO IN THE SAME PLANE, WHICH IS THE OTHER, THE OTHER ISSUE OF BEING RECESSED.
AND SO, UM, AND THAT'S THE THING THAT, THAT'S BEEN A ALSO A CHALLENGE.
BUT ROMAN, YOU WANTED TO ADD TO THIS AS WELL.
I, I, I WAS GONNA ACTUALLY JUST SAY THAT A LEGAL LOOK, UH, I THINK WE, WE MIGHT WANNA MOVE THIS.
YOU WERE THINKING MAYBE OF A DIFFERENT ITEM.
UH, PUT HER ON AGENDA FOR DISCUSSION.
I, I, I'M GONNA WORK WITH ROMAN.
UM, I THINK MAYBE AN IDEA IS, IS TO HAVE KIND OF A WRITTEN REPORT THAT EVEN JUST ITEMIZES THE ITEMS YOU'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT MM-HMM
UM, SO THAT THEN WE CAN TALK ABOUT THEM.
BUT YOU KNOW THIS, RIGHT NOW THE WAY IT'S POSTED IS A REPORT FROM ROMAN AND SO, AND CLEARLY IT'S AN ITEM OF GREAT INTEREST.
SO, YOU KNOW, WE PROBABLY OUGHT TO LOOK FOR A WAY TO REALLY MAKE IT AN AGENDA ITEM.
UM, SO THAT Y'ALL CAN REALLY DIVE INTO IT AND MAYBE WE CAN MOVE IT IN, PULL IT INTO CAMP OR SOMETHING.
YEAH, I WAS GONNA SAY NO, WE'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT WINDOWS AT CAMP
WE WILL, WE'LL WORK ON, YEAH, WE'LL, WE'LL, WE'LL, ACTUALLY THAT'S WHAT TERRENCE TOLD ME TO DO.
OH, BY THE WAY, WE DID IT LAST TIME AT THE FIREHOUSE.
AND WE HAVE TALKED TO THE FIREHOUSE.
IS TAYLOR'S STILL HERE? I CAN'T REMEMBER WHAT, I DON'T THINK THEY HAD ROOM THAT DAY.
DO YOU REMEMBER IF THE FIRE HOUSE IN THE HEIGHTS HAD ROOM? YOU, THEY HAVEN'T TALKED.
SEE IF THAT, HAVE YOU ZOOM REACHED OUT TO THE GHBA AND ASKED THE GHBA IF THEY WOULD ALLOW US TO USE THEIR CONFERENCE ROOM, THAT'D BE GREAT.
IT'S, OR WE COULD GO TO HERMAN PARK, THE NEW, UH, YEAH.
AGAIN, IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE MY REPORT, SO I'LL JUST SAY THANK YOU FOR ALL THE WORK Y'ALL DO AND, UH, THANK YOU VERY, VERY MUCH.
AND THIS MEETING IS ADJOURNED.