[Historic Preservation Appeals Board on February 27, 2023. ]
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1 1 2 7 OF THE TEXAS GOVERNMENT CODE, WHICH BECAME EFFECTIVE ON SEPTEMBER 1ST, 2021.THE CHAIR WILL BE PRESENT IN THE ROOM BOARD MEMBERS, STAFF, AND THE PUBLIC MAY ATTEND IN PERSON OR THROUGH VIDEO CONFERENCE LINK USING MICROSOFT TEAMS. AT THIS BOARD MEETING, APPLICANTS MAY OPEN AND SPEAK FOR A REASONABLE AMOUNT OF TIME, AND THE APPLICANTS ARE ENCOURAGED TO BE CONCISE.
IF BOARD MEMBERS HAVE QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT, YOU'LL BE GIVEN ADDITIONAL TIME TO ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS.
OTHER PUBLIC SPEAKERS MAY SPEAK WHEN I RECOGNIZE YOU TO SPEAK.
THE CHAIR RESERVES THE RIGHT TO LIMIT THE TIME FOR SPEAKERS.
IF YOU DO NOT SIGN UP TO SPEAK IN ADVANCE, YOU MAY SUBMIT A SPEAKER REQUEST TO STAFF, AND YOUR NAME WILL BE ANNOUNCED AT THE APPROPRIATE TIME.
IF JOINING VIRTUALLY, PLEASE MUTE YOURSELF AND PLEASE ONLY UNMUTE YOURSELF TO SPEAK WHEN I CALL ON YOU TO SPEAK BY NAME, BY NAME, USE YOUR COMPUTER'S MICROPHONE ICON TO MUTE, OR PRESS STAR SIX TO MUTE FROM MOST PHONES.
THIS MEETING MEETS CURRENT OPEN MEETING LEGAL REQUIREMENTS, SO LONG AS THE QUORUM OF MEMBERS ARE AUDIBLE AND VISIBLE WITH A CAMERA ON AND WITH A MIC READY TO BE TURNED ON.
IF VIRTUAL BOARD MEMBERS, PLEASE UNMUTE YOURSELF AND RESPOND BY REPEATING YOUR NAME AND SAYING, PRESENT OR VIRTUALLY PRESENT WHEN I CALL YOUR NAME, I AM THE CHAIR, JD BARTEL, AND I AM PRESENT.
VIRTUALLY PRESENT, ROB HELLER.
HELLER PRESENT, UH, LIBBY VIRA BLAND IS ABSENT TODAY.
AND DEBBIE? DEBBIE, DEBBIE, DEPUTY DIRECTOR JENNIFER OSLAND.
MAY I CALL FOR THE DIRECTOR'S REPORT? THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR.
UH, GOOD MORNING, UH, COMMISSIONERS.
MY NAME'S JENNIFER OSLAND, ACTING SECRETARY OF THIS BOARD, AND DEPUTY DIRECTOR OF THE HOUSTON PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT.
UH, WANTED TO LET YOU ALL KNOW WE, UH, WE, THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT CELEBRATED OUR, UM, 83RD BIRTHDAY ON VALENTINE'S DAY IN FEBRUARY.
WE WERE, UM, THE DEPARTMENT WAS CREATED ON FEBRUARY 14TH, 1940.
SO I WANNA THANK YOU, UH, BOARD MEMBERS AND STAFF FOR BEING DEVOTED PUBLIC SERVANTS.
WE'RE PROUD TO WORK WITH Y'ALL EVERY DAY.
ALSO, WANNA CONGRATULATE, UM, A BOARD MEMBER, VERA BLAND, WHO IS ON FAMILY LEAVE.
UM, AND WE ARE HOPING TO HEAR OF HER FIRST BABY'S ARRIVAL VERY SOON.
WE ARE ALSO CELEBRATING LOTS TO CELEBRATE THIS TIME.
UM, A NEW EMPLOYEE, TAYLOR VALLEY.
IT HAS JUST JOINED OUR HISTORIC OFFICE OF PRESERVATION TEAM.
WE ARE SO EXCITED TO HAVE HER.
UM, SHE'S A, A NATIVE HOUSTONIAN.
UM, SO WE, SHE'S BEEN ON BOARD FOR A FEW WEEKS.
UM, AND YOU PROBABLY HAVE HEARD ABOUT OUR CONSERVATION DISTRICT'S PROPOSAL.
UM, PROGRESS WAS BEING MADE ON THAT.
UH, WE, UH, HELD A HEARING BEFORE, OR CITY COUNCIL HELD A HEARING LAST WEEK.
UH, THE CONSERVATION DISTRICT, UH, PROPOSAL IS, UM, ANOTHER TOOL IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD PROTECTION TOOLBOX.
IT WILL ALLOW FOR A VARIETY OF NEIGHBORHOOD DRIVEN PROTECTION OPTIONS FOR SPECIFIED AREAS.
UM, A MINIMUM OF 51 SUPPORT BY THE AREA'S PROPERTY OWNERS IS PROPOSED JUST TO START THE PROCESS OF CREATING A DISTRICT.
THEN THE HISTORIC, UH, HOUSTON ARCHEOLOGICAL AND HISTORICAL COMMISSION WOULD HAVE TO AFFIRM THE PROPOSED CONSA CONSERVATION DISTRICT BY A 75% MAJORITY VOTE, AND THEN APPROVAL WOULD THEN BE BY 75% OF CITY COUNCIL.
ALL THE INFORMATION ABOUT THIS PROPOSAL, THIS IS THE ENABLING ORDINANCE.
WE'RE NOT ACTUALLY NOT CREATING ANY SPECIFIC DISTRICTS AT THIS TIME, BUT THE ENABLING ORDINANCE, UM, IS ON OUR WEBSITE.
LET'S TALK HOUSTON.ORG AND WE ENCOURAGE EVERYBODY TO GO, UH, READ IT, REVIEW IT, AND YOU CAN ALSO PROVIDE COMMENTS ON THAT SITE AS WELL.
WE ARE, UM, WORKING ON SCHEDULING A TRAINING FOR THIS BOARD, UM, AND WE'LL, UH, LET YOU KNOW SOON.
I THINK THAT'S ETHICS ANNUAL ETHICS TRAINING.
AND IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, YOU CAN CALL THE HOUSTON OFFICE OF PRESERVATION HOTLINE AT 8 3 2 3 9 3 6 5 5 6, OR VISIT OUR WEBSITE@HOUSTONPLANNING.COM.
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THANK YOU.THE PRIOR MEETING MINUTES WERE POSTED WITH THIS AGENDA.
MAY I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO ACCEPT THESE MINUTES? PLEASE STATE YOUR LAST NAME WHEN YOU MAKE A MOTION OR A SECOND.
UH, ELLIOT, UH, MOVED TO ACCEPT THE MINUTES.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF APPROVING THE MINUTES, ELLIOT AYE.
ADMINISTER VIRTUAL AYE AND BARTELL AYE.
THE NEXT ITEM ON THE AGENDA IS CONSIDERATION OF AND POSSIBLE ACTION ON AN APPEAL OF THE DECISION OF THE HOUSTON ARCHEOLOGICAL AND HISTORICAL COMMISSION ON JANUARY 26TH, 2023.
FIRST CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, 4 5 1 8 WEST 13TH STREET IN HOUSTON HEIGHTS, WEST HISTORIC DISTRICT STAFF.
MAY I HAVE YOUR REPORT BEFORE I CALL ON ANY SPEAKERS? THANK YOU, CHAIR.
THIS, UH, INVOLVES A PROJECT AT 5 1 8 WEST 13TH STREET IN HOUSTON, TEXAS.
UM, A SUMMARY IS ON THE FRONT PAGE OF THE, OF THE REPORT, UH, WHICH IS IN THE, UH, DOCUMENTS YOU HAVE.
AND JUST, I'M GONNA GO THROUGH, UH, E JUST THE STEPS OF HOW WE GOT HERE.
SO SUMMARY, UM, PROJECT SUMMARY IN JANUARY OF 2022, UH, A C OF A WAS ISSUED FOR A REAR EDITION TO THIS HOUSE IN FEBRUARY 11TH, A MONTH, UH, LESS THAN A MONTH LATER, AN ADMINISTRATIVE APPROVAL WAS ISSUED FOR A GARAGE APARTMENT AT THE SAME ADDRESS.
AND THEN LATER THAT YEAR ON SEPTEMBER THE EIGHTH, THERE WAS A C OF A ISSUE TO ALLOW TO CHANGE THE ROOF FROM COMPOSITION TO METAL, JUST A REQUIREMENT BECAUSE IT'S IN OUR CODE.
AND THEN SOMETIME BETWEEN THAT AND JANUARY 26TH, 2023, UM, THERE WAS WORK COMPLETED THAT, AND THE WORK PROGRESSED ON THE PROJECT WITH, WITH THE OWNER.
AND WINDOWS WERE INSTALLED IN THE ADDITION TO THE HOUSE AND IN THE GARAGE APARTMENT THAT WERE NOT IN THE STYLE APPROVED AND NOT, UH, NOT INSTALLED IN THE MANNER APPROVED, UH, BY THE, THE C OF A THAT WAS ISSUED.
BUT GOING BACK TO THAT DECISION OF THAT, THAT THE COMMISSION DECIDED THAT, UM, UH, THE, LET, LEMME BACK UP.
SO THE PERSON APPLIED FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO AMEND THAT EXISTING C OF A, TO BE ABLE TO KEEP THOSE WINDOWS THAT HE HAD INSTALLED.
AND THE HHC, UH, APPROVED A COUPLE OF THE WINDOWS THAT WERE ON THE WEST ELEVATION.
WHAT, WHICH, UH, IS OVER A CARPORT, UH, THE WAY THAT HE HAD INSTALLED THEM AS CASEMENT, SINGLE PANE GLASS.
HOWEVER, ON THE EAST ELEVATION THAT FACES AN ALLEY, THE COMMISSION, UH, TOOK STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION AND THEY SAID, UH, THAT THE FOUR EAST FACING WINDOWS IN THE ADDITION TO BE CHANGED BACK TO OR CHANGED INTO ONE OVER WINDOWS INSET AND RECESSED.
AND THAT'S THE MAIN DIFFERENCE IN ALLOWING FOR SOME SMALLER WINDOWS.
SO THAT, THAT IS WHAT THE APPEAL ITEM IS.
NOW THE APPLICANT, I WANT TO GO THROUGH WHAT HE SAID, AND THAT STARTS ON PAGE TWO OF THE STAFF REPORT PER THE APPLICANT.
UH, NUMBER ONE, HE SAYS THAT SECTION 33, 2 41 6, REGARDING NEW MATERIALS TO BE USED FOR ANY EXTERIOR FEATURE, CLEARLY STATES EXCLUDING WHAT IS VISIBLE FROM THE PUBLIC ALLEYS.
AND HE SAYS THAT BOTH PAIRS OF THESE WINDOWS FACE DIRECTLY TO THE ALLEY AND ARE VISIBLE FROM THE ALLEY AND ARE ALSO LOCATED WELL BEYOND THE HALFWAY POINT OF THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE.
AND THEN HE COMMENTS THAT, UM, CRITERIA THREE STATES THAT AN OBJECT HAS TO BE A SITE, HAS TO BE A PRODUCT OF HIS OWN TIME, AND THAT THE CASEMENT WINDOWS THAT HE'S INSTALLED ASSIST IN DIFFERENTIATING THE OLD HISTORICAL STRUCTURE FROM THE NEW EDITION.
FURTHER, UH, THE SECTION SIX QUALITATIVE GUIDELINES FOR ADDITIONS TO CONTRIBUTING AND NON-CONTRIBUTING BUILDINGS IN THE HOUSTON HEIGHTS DESIGN GUIDELINES STATES ABOUT DIFFERENTIATION THAT ADDITIONS MUST BE DIFFERENTIATED FROM THE EXISTING BUILDING.
IN OTHER WORDS, A PERSON LOOKING AT THE PROPERTY MUST BE ABLE TO TELL WHERE THE
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HISTORIC BUILDING STARTS AND THE ADDITION BEGINS.SO HE USE BELIEVES THAT THAT SUPPORTS HIS CASE FOR KEEPING THOSE WINDOWS FURTHER.
6.7 OF THE GUIDELINES STATE THAT WINDOWS IN ADDITION, IN AN ADDITION, MAY HAVE A SIMPLER LIGHT PATTERN THAN THE WINDOWS IN THE EXISTING BUILDING.
AND IF THE EXISTING BUILDING DESIGN IS SIMPLE, THE ADDITION SHOULD SIMILARLY BE MODEST.
AND IF THE EXISTING BUILDING IS MORE HIGHLY OR IN A MINUTE OR, OR EXUBERANT IN DESIGN, THE ADDITION CAN REFLECT THAT HIGHER LEVEL OF COMPLEXITY AND THAT THE SIZE PROFILE TYPE, COLOR, OR ORIENTATION OF MATERIALS MAY BE DIFFERENT.
FOR EXAMPLE, A BUILDING WHICH IS CLAD AND WOOD SIDING MAY HAVE AN ADDITION CLAD AND CEMENTITIOUS FIBER SIDING.
HIS SECOND POINT IS THAT, UH, WELL, HIS SECOND POINT IS REGARDING SOMETHING THAT I THINK IS JUST A POINT OF CONFUSION.
HE STATES THAT WE HAVE ADDED A LINE IN THE CRITERIA THAT SAYS THE NEWLY INSTALLED SINGLE PANE WINDOWS FLUSH MOUNTED DO NOT HAVE PRECEDENTS.
I UNDERSTAND THERE'S A TYPO THERE, PRECEDENT AMONG CONTRIBUTING HOUSES IN THE DISTRICT.
AND HE SAYS THAT THIS NEW CRITERION IS NOT PART OF THE CODE.
THAT'S JUST A MISUNDERSTANDING BECAUSE WHEN WE WRITE OUR STAFF REPORTS, WE WRITE UNDER THE CRITERIA.
IF IT'S NOT MEETING THE CRITERIA, WE WRITE, THE REASON WE THINK IT'S NOT MEETING THE CRITERIA.
HE SAYS THAT IF NEW ONE OVER ONE WINDOWS ARE INSTALLED PER HHC DECISION, THERE WOULD THEN BE THREE DIFFERENT TYPES OR THREE DIFFERENT STYLES OF WINDOWS VISIBLE FROM THE PUBLIC ALLEY.
THERE WOULD BE THE ORIGINAL ONE OVER ONE WINDOWS ON THE EXISTING HOUSE, THE ORIGINAL HISTORIC HOUSE, THE NEW DOUBLE HUNG 1 0 1 WINDOWS, AND THEN THE CASEMENT WINDOWS ON THE GARAGE.
AND THE GARAGE IS A SEPARATE STRUCTURE AT THE REAR.
UH, SO THEN ANOTHER POINT HE MAKES IN THE FOURTH AND FINAL REASON FOR THE APPEAL IS THAT UNDER SECTION 33, 2 40, GENERAL B, THE HHC SHALL TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION THE CURRENT NEEDS OF THE APPLICANT AND SHALL BE SENSITIVE TO THE PROPERTY OWNER'S FINANCIAL CONDITION IN DETERMINING WHETHER TO ISSUE A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS.
HE EXPLAINS THAT HE'S OVER BUDGET AND THE COST OF THE WINDOWS THAT THE HAG DECISION IS REQUIRING WILL BE $5,500.
AND HE'S ALREADY INVESTED IN THE CURRENT WINDOWS AND THEIR INSTALLATION.
SO TO REPLACE THEM WOULD RUN APPROXIMATELY 15.
WELL, HE SAYS WE'LL RUN $15,000.
ADDITIONALLY, THE REPLACEMENT WINDOWS WOULD TAKE A LOT MORE TIME AND COULD NOT, WE COULD NOT INSTALL THEM BEFORE THE MOVE-IN DATE DUE TO NEEDING AN OCCUPANCY PERMIT.
HE PREFERS THE CURRENT STYLE OF WINDOW.
IT'S AN OPERABLE CASEMENT WINDOW BECAUSE THEY ALLOW FOR THE BEST VENTILATION POSSIBLE.
HE SAYS THEY'RE FAR SUPERIOR TO THE UP AND DOWN ONE OVER ONE WINDOW STYLE, WHICH DO NOTHING TO CATCH AIRFLOW.
IN EFFECT, THEY ARE MORE SUSTAINABLE THAN THE ONE OVER ONE STYLE.
THIS IS TO BE OUR RETIREMENT HOME.
AND WE HAVE DESIGNED IT TO MEET OUR NEEDS PER SECTION 33 DASH 2 41 2.
THE PROPOSED ACTIVITY MUST CONTRIBUTE TO THE CONTRIBUTE, CONTINUED AVAILABILITY OF THE PROPERTY FOR CONTEMPORARY USE.
AND IN CONCLUSION, HE REQUESTS THAT THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION APPEALS BOIL LOOK FAVORABLY UPON THE REQUEST.
THE REST OF THE REPORT ON PAGE, THE BOTTOM OF PAGE THREE AND ONTO PAGE FOUR, IS SIMPLY A RECITAL OF THE CITY OF HOUSTON'S CODE OF ORDINANCE PERTAINING TO HOW THIS BOARD SHOULD PROCEED.
AND THE MAIN THING, OF COURSE, IS THAT THE APPEALS BOARD MAY REVERSE OR AFFIRM THE DECISION OF THE HHC BASED UPON THE CRITERIA APPLICABLE TO THE CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS.
UM, LET ME TAKE A MOMENT TO JUST GO OVER THE DETAILS.
SO IF WE GO TO THE, HERE WE HAVE THE STAFF REPORT THAT'S BEING APPEALED.
SO THIS STAFF REPORT'S ACTION WAS TO DENY A C OF A AND THEN ISSUE A C OF R ALLOWING FOR TWO CASEMENT WINDOWS TO, AGAIN, AS I WAS MAKING, REMAIN ON THE WEST ELEVATION OVER THE CARPORT, BUT THAT THE, UH, FOUR WINDOWS IN THE ADDITION TO THE WEST BE CHANGED TO THE ONE OVER ONE INSET AND RECESSED WINDOWS AS APPROVED.
AND THERE WAS ALSO A SMALLER WINDOW ON THE FIRST LEVEL OF THE ADDITION.
AND THE SINGLE PANE WINDOW ON THE ADDITION CAN REMAIN.
SO IF WE'LL GO FORWARD, UH, UH, MISS ARSLAN TO, UH, THE NEXT PAGE, YOU'VE GOT A MAP, YOU'VE GOT A, HERE'S A HIS INVENTORY PHOTOGRAPH OF THIS HOUSE.
AND THE NEXT PAGE IS THE HOUSE UNDER CONSTRUCTION.
AND THEN THE NEXT PAGE IS PROBABLY HELPFUL TO WHERE WE ARE NOW.
AT THE TOP OF THE PAGE IS THE ORIGINAL ELEVATION OF THE HOUSE.
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AND THEN THE NEXT MIDDLE PICTURE THERE IS THE ORIGINAL APPROVED ELEVATION.AS YOU CAN SEE, UM, THE APPROVED ELEVATION ACTUALLY RETAINED A THIRD PAIR OF ORIGINAL WINDOWS ON THAT SIDE ELEVATION, OR WHAT WE KNOW TO BE AN ORIGINAL PAIR.
SO AGAIN, IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE MIDDLE IMAGE BEFORE YOU UP HERE, UM, YOU NOTE THAT THE SIDE ELEVATION OF THE ORIGINAL HOUSE HAD THREE PAIRS OF ONE OVER ONES.
AND SO WE APPROVED TO RETAIN THAT THIRD PAIR, BUT INSTALL ABOVE IT ON THE NEW ADDITION ABOVE THE HOUSE, A PAIR OF ONE OVER ONE WINDOWS, AND THEN ONE SINGLE PANE WINDOW THAT'S SORT OF IN AN INSET PORTION OF THE HOUSE.
THAT INSET IS REQUIRED BY THE GUIDELINES OF THE HEIGHTS DESIGN GUIDELINES THAT YOU INSET TWO FEET AT AN ORIGINAL CORNER.
NOW, DOWN BELOW, IF WE COULD ZOOM IN THERE, MAYBE ON THAT BOTTOM PAGE, JUST FOR THE PURPOSES OF, UH, THE PUBLIC THERE, WHAT YOU SEE THERE IS WHAT ACTUALLY IS, UH, THE APPLICANT APPLIED FOR WITH HIS AMENDMENT.
AND THAT WAS THAT THE TWO WINDOWS ON THE TOP OF THE ADDITION OVER THE HOUSE WERE CASEMENT WINDOWS, AN ADDITIONAL WINDOW IN THE MIDDLE, IN THE INSET PORTION OF THE ADDITION, AND THEN TWO MORE CASEMENT WINDOWS AT THE REAR AND THEN BELOW AT THE FIRST LEVEL, AT THE VERY BACK CORNER, YOU SEE THAT, THAT THREE WINDOWS TOGETHER, SINGLE PANE.
AND ALSO YOU SEE THAT THERE'S A, A LINE THROUGH THE ORIGINAL PAIR, THE ORIGINAL THIRD SET OF WINDOWS ON THE REAR OF THE HOUSE.
THE HHC AGREED THAT IT WAS OKAY TO REMOVE THOSE, UH, AS PART OF THAT CERTIFICATE OF REMEDIATION, UH, BASED ON THAT, THAT IT WAS ON THE REAR PORTION OF A SIDE ELEVATION.
AND THE, THE APPLICANT STATED THAT THE CONDITION WAS POOR, BUT FOR US, WE DIDN'T KNOW THE CONDITION.
IT WAS JUST A MATTER THAT THEY WERE ON THE SIDE REAR, UH, SIDE, THE REAR OF THE SIDE ELEVATION.
IF WE COULD GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE.
OUR NEXT PAGE WE HAVE, AGAIN, THE, THE ORIGINAL HOUSE AT THE TOP.
UM, AND IT'S, IT'S VERY INTERESTING, THE ORIGINAL HOUSE, THAT PORTION THAT IS EXTENDING WESTWARD WAS BUILT MUCH LATER THAN THE ORIGINAL HOUSE.
BY THE WAY, THE ORIGINAL HOUSE WAS MOVED TO ITS LOCATION IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
AND, UH, SO FROM ANOTHER PLACE.
BUT THEN THIS PORTION AT THE TOP OF THE PAGE THAT YOU'RE SEEING THAT HAS TWO LITTLE WINDOWS IN IT, WHICH IS THAT WESTERN SORT OF WING IS, UH, IS AN ADDITION THAT WAS ACTUALLY A CARPORT.
IT HAD A SLAB UNDER THERE FROM THE FRONT.
IT KINDA READ HIS APPEARED BEAM HOUSE, BUT THERE WAS ACTUALLY A SLAB.
SO HE IS, UM, WORKING ON THAT ELEVATION.
AND IN THE MIDDLE YOU HAVE THE APPROVED APPROVAL.
UM, AND THEN THE BOTTOM, THEY REQUESTED REVISIONS.
WE MADE NO, WE HAD NO CONCERN WITH THE CHANGES, UM, THAT ARE IN THAT PROPOSAL WHEN WE WENT TO COMMISSION, BECAUSE THAT ELEVATION, THOUGH, IT APPEARS IT'S JUST PART OF THE HOUSE HERE, IT'S ACTUALLY A KIND OF AN L-SHAPED HOUSE, AND IT'S VERY OBSCURED FROM THE RIGHT OF WAY.
WE WERE NOT A CONCERNED AT ALL WITH THE FOUR CASEMENT WINDOWS ON THE SECOND FLOOR OF THAT WESTERN ELEVATION.
AND THE HHC AGREED THAT THE REPLACEMENT OF THE, OF THE INSTALLING OF TWO CASEMENT WINDOWS IN THE GABLE OF THAT CARPORT WAS FINE.
HERE WE HAVE A PHOTOGRAPH OF THE HOUSE AT THE TOP AND A PHOTOGRAPH AT THE BOTTOM WHILE UNDER CONSTRUCTION OF THE WORK, AND I THINK I'LL STOP THERE, BUT WE, THE APPLICANT IS HERE TODAY, AND WE HAVE PHOTOGRAPHS OF THE, UH, WORK WHERE IT IS TODAY.
I BELIEVE THOSE WILL BE SHARED IN A BIT, AND THAT'LL HELP TO SEE WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE TODAY.
AS, AS IT'S BEEN THE APPLICANT HAS COMPLIED WITH, UM, THE, THERE WAS A C OF R ALSO BEFORE YOU, UH, HOW SHOULD I SAY? WHEN THEY APPLIED TO AMEND THE C OF A, THEY WERE AMENDING TWO, THEY WERE AMENDING THE ADDITION TO THE HOUSE, BUT THEY WERE ALSO AMENDING THE ADMINISTRATIVELY APPROVED GARAGE APARTMENT, WHICH HAD THE TWO CASEMENT WINDOWS IN IT.
THE HAC TREATED THOSE IN A COMBINED FASHION.
AND WITH RESPECT TO THE GARAGE APARTMENT, THEY SAID HE COULD RETAIN THE SINGLE CASEMENT WINDOWS.
AND SO THE, THE, THAT, AND IT JUST, HE NEEDED TO ADD TO TRIMS. THAT'S, HE'S NOT, UH, APPEALING THAT.
I JUST WANNA LET YOU KNOW THAT THAT HAPPENED.
AND I'LL TAKE ANY QUESTIONS IF I HAVEN'T THOROUGHLY CONFUSED YOU BY NOW.
I DID DRIVE BY THE PROPERTY, BUT
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I'M GONNA HOLD OFF ON ANY QUESTIONS UNTIL AFTER WE HEAR FROM THE, UH, THE APPLICANT.WE'RE SUPPOSED TO WAIT UNTIL AFTER.
UM, I DO HAVE ONE SPEAKER, UH, FOR A, AND I APOLOGIZE IF I SAY THE NAME WRONG.
IS IT MARK LAPIN? LAPIN LAPIN.
UM, AND HE IS SIGNED UP TO SPEAK ON THIS MATTER.
PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME INTO THE MIC.
MARK LAPIN, MORE TIME NOW THAT THE MIC'S ON.
MARK LAPIN, AND I'M THE HOME HOMEOWNER.
UM, I WANNA START OFF, MY WIFE HAD COME TO THE LAST MEETING.
UM, SHE CRIED A LITTLE BIT TOO MUCH, SO SHE WAS BARRED FROM THIS ONE.
THIS IS, THIS IS A, A REAL HEARTBREAKER FOR US.
AND, AND I'D LIKE TO, UH, GIVE A LITTLE BACKGROUND ON THIS HOME.
WE DID NOT COME INTO THIS AND DECEIVINGLY CHANGE THESE WINDOWS OUT.
WE HAD A CONTRACTOR, UM, THE CONTRACTOR CAME BY.
WE THOUGHT HE WAS A GREAT GUY.
WE WENT TO ORDER THE WINDOWS, THE DOUBLE-HUNG WINDOWS IN JULY, EARLY JULY OF LAST SUMMER.
AND THERE WAS STILL A MAJOR SHORTAGE SUPPLY OF, OF WINDOWS.
THE WINDOWS, THE DOUBLE HUNG WINDOWS WAS AN ISSUE THAT WAS GONNA TAKE, UH, BETWEEN SIX, NO, I'M SORRY, BETWEEN, UH, THREE TO FOUR MONTHS LONGER FROM ANDERSON.
UH, I KNOW YOU CAN GET THOSE LESS EXPENSIVE, UM, GEL.
IS IT GEL WINDOWS OR THE BRAND? BUT WE CHOSE NOT TO DO THAT.
WE WANTED SOME, SOME NICER WINDOWS IN THERE.
AND WHAT WE COULD GET IN A TIMELY DELIVERMENT WERE THE CASEMENT WINDOWS.
UH, THE CONTRACTOR SAID, THAT'S FINE.
SO WE ORDERED THOSE AND WE GOT THOSE DELIVERED IN A TIMELY MANNER IN THE FALL.
AS WE PROGRESSED IN THE FALL, WE STARTED GOING BACK THROUGH THE BOOKS AND LEARNING, UH, THAT WE WERE LITERALLY BEING TAKEN BY THE CLEANERS.
UH, HE WAS OVERBILLING US ON EVERYTHING.
AND, UM, WE ELECTED TO PART WAYS WITH HIM.
SO MY MY POINT OF THIS IS THAT WE DID NOT COME INTO THIS AND INTENTIONALLY, UH, TRY TO GET AWAY WITH PUTTING DIFFERENT WINDOWS IN.
UM, SO THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF THE BACKGROUND OF IT.
THE, THE, AS WE MOVE FORWARD, UM, IN OUR DECISION TO PURCHASE THE HOME, UM, THE INVENTORY PHOTO THAT I HAVE UP HERE, UH, SHOWS TO BE A, A VERY PRETTY HOUSE.
WE ABSOLUTELY, YOU KNOW, IT'S ONE OF THOSE SITUATIONS THAT WE DECIDED TO PURCHASE THE HOME A LITTLE BIT MORE BECAUSE OF THE TREE.
THE TREE IS SPECTACULAR, AND I JUST, I'VE ALWAYS DREAMT OF, OF LIVING IN A HOME WITH A TREE LIKE THIS.
THERE'S TWO OF THEM, OURS IN THE NEIGHBOR.
WE WERE TOLD THAT THE HOUSE COULD, UH, MOST LIKELY, UH, IF WE BROUGHT IT TO THE COMMITTEE TO, UH, BE A NON-CONFORMING, THIS WAS ALL BRAND NEW TO US, BY THE WAY.
AND, UH, BE, IT COULD HAVE BEEN, UH, RECLASSIFIED AS A NON-CONFORMING.
THE HOUSE WAS ACTUALLY, THE LEFT SIDE OF THE HOUSE WAS ACTUALLY MOVED HERE SOMETIME IN THE FIFTIES.
UH, THERE'S NO DOCUMENTATION SPECIFIC ON THAT, ON THE RIGHT SIDE.
UH, THAT'S ACTUALLY A GARAGE THAT WAS BUILT, UH, UH, WE THINK IN 1973 BECAUSE THERE'S SOME, UM, ON THE CONCRETE, THERE'S SOME HANDWRITTEN DATE ON THERE.
AND THEN THE DORMERS WERE BUILT ABOUT 15 YEARS AGO.
THE CARPORT WAS ABOUT 15 YEARS AGO.
BUT WE CHOSE TO, TO TAKE ON THIS PROJECT, EVEN THOUGH A BLOCK AWAY, WE COULD HAVE, UH, GOTTEN A HOUSE AND, AND PROBABLY, UH, LESS MONEY AND TORN IT DOWN AND, AND HAD A BRAND NEW ONE.
BUT WE ENDED UP DIVING INTO IT.
IF I COULD HAVE THE NEXT SLIDE.
MY, MY POINT ON THIS SLIDE, IF YOU CAN SEE IT, THE HOUSE WAS, UH, WAS IN, IT WAS, IT WAS A TEAR DOWN HOUSE, BUT WE REALLY WANTED TO SAVE IT.
UH, IT HAD, UH, UNLIKE THE INVENTORY PHOTO, UH, WHEN YOU WALKED IN THE INSIDE, IT WAS FULL OF MOLD.
IT WAS, UH, WOOD ROTT EVERYWHERE.
UM, THERE WAS, UH, YOU CAN SEE THE PICTURES OF THE MOLD.
UH, THERE WAS NO PLUMBING IN IT.
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HADN'T WORKED.UM, I DON'T KNOW HOW HE LIVED THERE IN, IN THE LATTER PART OF THE YEAR, BUT HE HAD TOTALLY LET IT RUN DOWN THE PREVIOUS OWNER.
AND WE ENDED UP, UM, HAVING TO TINT IT.
AND THEN IT WAS COMPLETELY LINED UP WITH, UM, WITH ASBESTOS SIDING.
SO WE HAD TO TAKE THE ASBESTOS SIDING OFF.
UM, AND LEMME SEE THE NEXT, NEXT SLIDE.
WE, AS, AS ROMANS SAID, WE DID PUT THE WINDOWS IN.
THIS IS THE VIEW FROM THE STREET.
UM, THEY WERE THE CASEMENT WINDOWS THAT WERE PUT IN THERE WERE PUT, PUT IN FLUSH.
AND THE, UH, THE APPLICANT, THE COA FOR THE GARAGE, WHICH IS NEW CONSTRUCTION, AS HE INDICATED, UH, THE CASEMENT WINDOWS WERE APPROVED AS LONG AS WE ADDED TRIM TO IT.
AND, UM, PUT SOME, UM, UM, UH, APRONS ON THERE THAT, UH, ON THE BOTTOM, SO THEY PROTRUDED OUT TO, TO MATCH THE HISTORICAL LOOK OF, OF THE FRONT.
SO WHAT WE ENDED UP DOING BETWEEN NOW AND THEN, WE DID THAT TO THE GARAGE, UM, WINDOWS.
BUT IN ADDITION, IF YOU ZOOM HERE, SO THE GREEN HERE IS WHERE ALL THE WINDOWS THAT WERE APPROVED.
AND THEN THE RED ARE THE TWO SETS OF WINDOWS THAT THEY'VE ASKED FOR US TO REPLACE THOSE.
WHAT WE DID ON HERE, WHICH IT LOOKS FANTASTIC, UH, WE DID PUT THE TRIM ON ALL OF 'EM JUST TO SHOW YOU THAT, UM, HOW NICE THE WINDOWS LOOK.
AND WE PUT THE BASE ON THERE, THE APRON, AND IT PROTRUDES OUT.
WE'VE GOT FOUR, UH, UH, LETTERS FROM THE NEIGHBORS DIRECTLY, DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET AND NEXT DOOR.
WE SIT OUT ON THE PORCH IN THE EVENINGS DURING CONSTRUCTION.
AND I GOTTA TELL YOU, PEOPLE LOVE WHAT WE'VE DONE TO THIS HOUSE.
THEY THANK US, THEY WALK BY, THEY WANNA COME INSIDE AND SEE IT.
AND MY POINT OF SHOWING THE, THE, THE PICTURES OF THIS THING IN THE BEGINNING IS WE'VE DONE A LOT TO, UH, TO BRING THIS HOME BACK, UH, AS UNDER THE CONFORMING STATUS.
UM, I JUST CAN'T, WE ARE SO EXCITED TO GET, GET IN AND MOVED IN AND TO PUT THE PICTURE TO, UH, REPLACE THOSE WINDOWS.
AND, AND AGAIN, I, I'LL STEP BACK.
I APOLOGIZE FOR YOU GUYS TAKING YOUR TIME AND COMING HERE.
I I, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN I LEFT THE LAST MEETING, I, I, I WALKED OUT LIKE THIS.
AND, UM, I STANDING OUT THERE AND I WAS WAITING FOR MY WIFE, AND MY WIFE WALKED UP, AND THIS LADY WALKED UP AND SHE GOES, SO ARE YOU GONNA APPEAL? AND I SAID, I, I THINK SO.
I SAID IT, IT SAYS RIGHT HERE.
IT SAYS, UH, UH, ON MY POINT NUMBER ONE, IT SAYS, EXCLUDING WHAT IS VISIBLE FROM PUBLIC ALLEYWAY.
SHE GOES, I KNOW IT'S IN BLACK AND WHITE.
AND I SAID, WHAT ROLE DO YOU PLAY? SHE GOES, MY NAME'S, UH, KIM, UH, MICKELSON.
AND I SAID, AND WERE YOU IN THE MEETING? 'CAUSE I DIDN'T SAY HER.
SHE SAID, YES, I'M THE CITY ATTORNEY.
SHE GOES, CALL ME IN THE MORNING OR SEND ME WHATEVER, AND I'LL TALK TO ROMAN.
SHE GOES, I THINK CORRECT ME ROMAN IF I'M WRONG, BUT SHE SAID, I THINK WE HAVE A, A LANGUAGE ISSUE, UH, ON THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN.
UH, BECAUSE ON ON NUMBER ONE, THE APPROVAL CRITERIA, IT SAYS, REGARDING NEW MATERIALS, UH, THIS IS, UH, NUMBER SIX, PARAGRAPH SIX OF THE CODE, 3, 3, 2, 4, 1, REGARDING NEW MATERIALS TO BE USED FOR THE EXTERIOR FEATURE, EXCLUDING WHAT IS VISIBLE FROM PUBLIC ALLEYS.
UH, AND THIS IS PUBLIC ALLEYWAY VIEW, AND THEY'VE APPROVED ALL THE WINDOWS EXCEPT FOR THESE TWO PAIR.
AND TO REPLACE JUST THOSE TWO SETS UP THERE, WE WOULD HAVE, ESSENTIALLY, WE WOULD HAVE THREE SETS OF WINDOWS ALONG THAT ALLEYWAY.
WE WOULD HAVE THE, THE ORIGINAL HISTORICAL, A DOUBLE HUNG, A NEW SET OF MODERN DOUBLE HUNGS UP THERE, AND THEN THE, UH, CASEMENT WINDOWS IN THE REAR.
SO WE ARE, WE'RE ASKING IF WE COULD PLEASE JUST MAINTAIN WHAT WE'VE GOT UP THERE.
UM, WE'VE, WE'VE GONE AND ADDED THE, UM, UH, THE TRIM UP THERE TO MATCH THE, THE GARAGE.
AND THEN THE OTHER POINT THAT WE BROUGHT UP IN HERE, I KNOW I'M WAY OVER AND
[00:30:01]
I APOLOGIZE, UH, BUT THE CODE SAYS CLEARLY THAT IT NEEDS TO DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN THE OLD AND THE NEW.AND, AND THE YELLOW LINE THERE IS THE ORIGINAL AND THE NEW IS, UH, BEHIND IT AND ABOVE IT, AND WITHIN THE DESIGN GUIDELINES, IT CLEARLY STATES WE DON'T WANNA CHANGE OUT THOSE, THOSE WINDOWS TO DOUBLE HUNG AND NOT MATCH THE ONES IN THE BACK.
I'VE GONE THROUGH IT WITH MY NEIGHBORS, WE'VE WALKED IT, AND THEY, AND EVERYBODY'S SHAKING THEIR HEAD.
THEY SAY, WELL, THAT'S MAKES NO SENSE.
WHY WOULD YOU WANNA DO THAT? YOU'D HAVE THREE SETS OF WINDOWS.
SO, UM, THE WINDOWS, I MEAN, IT, IT, UM, ROMAN WENT THROUGH ALL THIS, AND THERE'S NO REASON FOR ME TO REITERATE THIS, BUT IT, IT SHOULD BE DIFFERENT.
AS OUR ARCHITECT SAID, IT NEEDS TO BE DIFFERENT.
YOU NEED TO DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN THE OLD AND THE NEW, AND WE'VE CLEARLY DONE THAT.
UM, SO I THINK I'VE GONE OVER THING.
AND IN REGARDS TO, UM, OUR, THE, THE COST OF THIS THING, UH, WE'VE, WE'RE WAY OVER BUDGET, NOT TO ANYBODY'S FAULT HERE, BUT, UH, WE'RE WAY OVER BUDGET AND THE COST TO REPLACE THESE WINDOWS.
SO THE, THE QUOTE FROM ANDERSON WAS 5,500 PLUS TAX, AND THEN WE HAVE TO RIP OUT THE OLD ONES.
WE'VE ALREADY GOT AN INVESTMENT IN THAT AREA ALREADY, AND IT'S GONNA BE, DEPENDING ON WHO WE USE, IF WE USE OUR REGULAR GUY, WHICH KIND OF MESSED IT UP, WE'D HAVE TO, WE WANT TO USE SOMEBODY THAT KNOWS WHAT THEY'RE DOING.
THE SECOND ISSUE IS WE'RE WE'VE FINISHED SHEET ROCK, WE'RE, OR PAINTING NOW WE'RE STARTING PAINTING, UH, THIS WEEK, AND WE HOPE TO BE, WE NEED TO BE IN WITHIN THE NEXT 60 DAYS.
AND TO GET THESE OTHER WINDOWS WOULD BE BEYOND THAT.
SO WE COULDN'T GET OUR, UH, PERMANENT OCCUPANCY, UH, UH, PERMIT TO GET MOVED IN.
SO, AGAIN, I APOLOGIZE, UH, FOR BRINGING YOU GUYS HERE.
I THOUGHT AFTER THE CONVERSATION WITH KIM, I, I REALLY THOUGHT THAT THIS WOULD BE AN ISSUE THAT WOULD BE WORKED OUT AMONGST, UH, YOU KNOW, BEHIND CLOSED DOORS WITH THE LANGUAGE.
SO, UH, I FIGURED THIS THING'S COSTING AT LEAST $10,000 FOR EVERYBODY TO COME HERE.
YOUR TIME, THE OPPORTUNITY COSTS, I MEAN, YOU'RE VOLUNTEERING YOUR TIME.
AND FOR MY WIFE
AND THANK YOU FOR TAKING YOUR TIME FOR DRIVING OVER THERE.
THAT'S MY OPINION IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD.
TO SPEAK ON WHAT SHE SAID TO YOU.
UM, AND I ALSO LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT I THINK MRS. LAP LAPIN IS NOT HERE BY THEIR OWN ACCORD, NOT BY US ASKING THAT SHE NOT APPEAR.
UM, OF COURSE THIS IS VERY EMOTIONAL FOR HOMEOWNERS AND, UM, WE, WE CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND THAT THAT'S NOT, THAT'S NOT UNUSUAL AT ALL.
I DID HAVE A BRIEF CONVERSATION WITH MR. AND MRS. LAPIN AFTER THE, UM, CONVERSATION WHERE I INDICATED THAT THIS IS A QUESTION OF APPEAL.
THERE'S A QUESTION ABOUT WHAT THE LANGUAGE IS INTENDED TO DO AND SAY WITH REGARD TO THE STREET FRONTAGE ITEM ONLY.
UM, BUT AFTER EXTENSIVE CONVERSATIONS WITH ROMAN AND WITH MARGARET WALLACE BROWN, WE DETERMINED THERE WAS NO ADMINISTRATIVE WAY TO, UM, TO CORRECT THIS.
THIS IS, THIS IS AN INTERPRETATION QUESTION, UM, THAT EVALUATES THE, THE BASIS ON WHICH THE HISTORIC COMMISSION MADE THEIR, MADE THEIR DECISION, AND THAT THIS IS THE APPROPRIATE BOARD TO HEAR IT.
AND THAT'S WHY THIS BOARD IS CONSTITUTED AND PRESENT.
SO HENCE WHY WE ARE ALL HERE TODAY.
AND I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER QUESTIONS, OBVIOUSLY.
UH, YEAH, I JUST HAD A QUESTION FOR THE APPLICANT, AND THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR PRESENTATION.
AND, UH, THE ADDITIONAL PICTURES, AND MAYBE, I DON'T KNOW WHO HAS TO ANSWER THIS QUESTION, BUT THE, THE GREEN WINDOWS YOU, AS FAR AS YOU'RE CONCERNED, AND I BELIEVE THE CITY YOU'VE COMPLIED WITH THE CERTIFICATE OF REMEDIATION OF WHAT THEY'VE ASKED YOU TO DO FOR THOSE, UH, REARMOST CASEMENT WINDOWS.
AND THEN FOR THE IN ADDITION, WE DID THAT TO, WELL, THAT'S WHAT, YEAH, LEMME JUST, YEAH, THAT'S WHAT I UNDERSTAND.
SO IN THE OTHER ONES, THEY TOLD YOU YOU CAN'T DO THAT SAME FIX.
YOU NEED TO ACTUALLY PHYSICALLY TAKE THOSE CASE WINDOWS OUT
[00:35:01]
AND PUT IN OTHER ONES.BUT YOU TOOK THE EFFORT TO GO AHEAD AND DO THE TRIM TO SEE HOW IT WOULD LOOK OR JUST TO MAKE IT ALL THE SAME.
AND NOW YOU'RE PROPOSING THAT IN A WAY WE, UH, MODIFY THE CERTIFICATE OF MEDIATION TO INCLUDE DOING THE SAME FIX TO THESE WINDOWS.
UH, I MEAN, I, I GET A LITTLE HUNG UP IN PROCEDURAL.
I MEAN, YOU, YOU'D WANTED US TO, UM, REVERSE THEIR DENIAL OF, OF LEAVING ALL THE WINDOWS AS IS, BUT YOU'VE ALREADY MADE THESE CHANGES.
AND SO IN A WAY, YOU'RE ASKING US TO CHANGE THE CERTIFICATE OF MEDIATION TO INCLUDE THE, THE FRONT SET OF WINDOWS ALSO.
IS THAT A FAIR WAY TO DESCRIBE WHAT'S HAPPENING? I, I, YEAH, I THINK SO.
THAT'S, THAT'S IS THAT THE CITY'S FEW TWO.
AND, UM, I'VE GOT SOME THOUGHTS ABOUT THE, UH, THE LANGUAGE THAT'S BEEN, UH, AT ISSUE.
AND THIS IS NOT A QUESTION FOR YOU, SO IF YOU WANT TO SIT, THAT'S FINE.
UM, UH, I KNOW IT, THE HHC ROMAN, YOU MENTIONED PUBLIC RIGHT OF WAY, AND THAT'S HOW I USED TO THINK IT WAS IN THE ORDINANCE.
YOU KNOW, I GO BACK AND LOOK AT IT, AND SOME OF THIS STUFF IS, I THINK BECAUSE THE ORDINANCE WAS AMENDED OVER TIME, I BELIEVE WHAT IT IS AT ISSUE IS IT'S, IT'S BUILT INTO THE DEFINITION OF EXTERIOR FEATURE.
AND I THINK THE WAY THE DEFINITION READS NOW IS VISIBLE FROM A STREET, AND THEN IN FACT, STREET IS LAYERED, DEFINED IS NOT INCLUDING ALLEYS.
AND SO I THINK WHAT WE'VE GOT HERE IN THIS PARTICULAR PART OF THE ORDINANCE IS, IS KIND OF A, A, A VESTIGIAL REDUNDANCY THAT, UH, AT ONE POINT WAS TRYING TO CLARIFY THAT IF IT'S A PUBLIC RIGHT OF WAY, BUT IT'S AN ALLEY, UM, DON'T COUNT THAT AS BEING VISIBLE FROM THE STREET.
AND SO IT, IT'S NOT, I DON'T THINK THROWS A BLANKET OF WHERE ANYTHING THAT'S VISIBLE FROM A PUBLIC ALLEY DOESN'T HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE ORDINANCE.
I THINK IT'S SUPPOSED TO SAY, IF IT'S ONLY VISIBLE FROM A, AN ALLEY, THEN IT DOESN'T COUNT AS AN EXTERIOR FEATURE, BUT IF IT'S VISIBLE FROM THE STREET, IT COUNTS AS AN EXTERIOR FEATURE THAT'S SUBJECT TO THE ORDINANCE.
AND I THINK THAT'S THE ONLY CONSISTENT THING.
I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY REASON TO THINK THAT IF IT'S VISIBLE FROM THE PUBLIC ALLEY AND THE STREET, IT SHOULDN'T BE COVERED BY THE ORDINANCE, WHICH I THINK IS WHAT THE APPLICANT IS SUGGESTING.
UM, BECAUSE YES, I MEAN, LITERALLY THAT'S WHAT IT SAYS, EXCLUDING WHAT'S VISIBLE FROM A PUBLIC ALLEY.
BUT I DON'T THINK YOU CAN READ THAT IN THE TOTALITY OF THE ORDINANCE AND THINK THAT, UM, THAT MEANS THAT, UH, IF IT'S VISIBLE FROM THE ALLEY AND A STREET, IT'S NOT COVERED BY THE ORDINANCE.
THAT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE TO ME.
SO I THINK IT'S JUST, IT'S LEFT OVER AS A WAY TO INTENSIFY AND CLARIFY, WHICH NOW IS CONFUSING.
BUT AT THE TIME TO MAKE SURE PEOPLE WEREN'T GETTING, BEING PENALIZED BECAUSE THEIR STREET, THEIR HOUSE WAS ON AN ALLEY AND THEY HAD TO COMPLY, YOU KNOW, A, A FULL TWO 70 OR 360 OF THEIR HOUSE BECAUSE THE ALLEY WENT ALL THE WAY AROUND WHEN EVERYONE ELSE ONLY HAS TO WORRY ABOUT WHAT'S VISIBLE FROM THE STREET.
AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S CLEAR OR HELPFUL OR CONTRADICTORY TO WHAT YOU ALL THINK IS HOW IT SHOULD BE.
UM, UH, I'M GONNA JUST KEEP GOING SINCE I GOT THE MIC.
SO I, I, AGAIN, I APPRECIATE THE APPLICANT FOR BEING VERY SPECIFIC ABOUT WHAT THEY FELT, WHAT THE ISSUE WAS.
AND I, I BELIEVE YOU'RE RIGHT, THAT THERE'S NOTHING ABOUT, IT HAS TO BE A, A UNPRECEDENTED ITEM.
AND, BUT FROM READING WHAT THE HHC DID, THE ISSUE REALLY IS WHETHER OR NOT THOSE SINGLE, UH, PANE CASEMENT WINDOWS FIXED OR FIXED APPEARING WINDOWS ARE VISUALLY COMPATIBLE.
THAT'S REALLY THE, THE KEY ISSUE WHEN YOU'RE, UH, EVALUATING A, A NEW EXTERIOR FEATURE ON AN ADDITION.
AND I, I THINK WHAT, UH, CHAIRMAN BUTCH SAID IS THEY'D NEVER HAVE APPROVED THOSE BEFORE.
SO I THINK THAT'S WHERE YOU GET INTO, IT'S NOT REALLY PRECEDENT, WHICH TO ME MEANS THEY'VE NEVER THOUGHT THOSE ARE VISUALLY COMPATIBLE.
THEY'VE NEVER FELT LIKE WINDOWS THAT LOOK LIKE THAT ARE VISUALLY COMPATIBLE WITH THE HISTORIC WINDOWS AND THE HEIGHTS.
THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING WHAT THAT MEANS.
I'VE GOT SOME MORE IDEAS OR THOUGHTS ABOUT WHAT YOU'VE PROPOSED AS THE OTHER CHANGE, BUT, UH, I, I DON'T WANNA KEEP TALKING AND BE THE ONLY ONE TALKING
I SHOW TWO MORE, TWO OR THREE ADDITIONAL SLIDES.
[00:40:02]
SO I, I DO FULLY RECOGNIZE THAT THESE ARE NOT, UH, NEIGHBOR'S HOUSES THAT ARE, UH, CONFORMING.BUT THESE ARE THREE HOUSES JUST RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER.
UM, IT'S GOT CASEMENT WINDOWS, OR PICTURE WINDOWS RIGHT ON THE SIDE.
AND AGAIN, I, I FULLY UNDERSTAND THESE ARE NOT, UH, HISTORICAL CONFORMING HOMES, BUT IT'S NOT UNCOMMON.
SO THAT'S, UH, JUST A BLOCK AND A HALF FROM THE HOUSE AND THE NEXT ONE, AND THAT'S A, UH, A BLOCK AND A HALF OVER.
UH, THEY'VE GOT, UH, THE DOUBLE HUNG IN THE FRONT AND THEN CASEMENTS ON THE SIDE.
AND THEN THE NEXT ONE IS ANOTHER EXAMPLE, UH, RIGHT ON THAT SAME STREET.
SO I, I UNDERSTAND I'M NOT SITTING HERE SAYING THAT THESE ARE HISTORICAL CONFORMING HOMES, BUT THEY ARE NEIGHBOR'S HOMES AND THEY'RE RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER FROM OUR HOUSE.
SO I JUST WANTED TO BRING THAT UP.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE TO START, ACTUALLY.
UM, AS FAR AS THE LANGUAGE THAT HE CITED, INCLUDING WHAT IS VISIBLE FROM PUBLIC ALLEYS, UM, YOU KNOW, I WAS ON THE COMMISSION FOR EIGHT YEARS AND I DON'T RECALL EVER SEEING AN APPLICATION WHERE THE ALLEY WENT BESIDE THE HOUSE, UH, AS OPPOSED TO BEHIND IT.
SO WE HAVE KIND OF A, SOMEWHAT OF A UNIQUE SITUATION IN THAT RESPECT.
UM, AND DRIVING BY THERE YESTERDAY, I MEAN, I BASICALLY SAW THE SAME VIEW THAT'S, YOU KNOW, ON THE SCREEN CURRENTLY.
UM, A STRICT INTERPRETATION SAYS, YOU KNOW, IS THAT IT'S EXCLUDED 'CAUSE IT'S ON THE ALLEY, BUT THIS MIGHT
UM, I WANNA SHARE SOMETHING, AND MAYBE YOU CAN PUT IT ON THE PROJECTOR SO, UH, TRUMAN CAN SEE IT.
THIS, UH, IS MY PERSONAL PROPERTY AND, UH, WITH A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, GRANTED, UH, DOCUMENT CAMERA PLEASE.
WE'RE ASKING HTV TO SWITCH ON THE DOCUMENT CAMERA TO SHOW YOUR EXHIBIT.
CAN YOU, I GUESS YOU NEED TO ZOOM OUT A LITTLE BIT SO YOU CAN SEE THE WINDOWS UPSTAIRS AND DOWNSTAIRS AND APOLOGIZE FOR THE MEXICAN PLUM DROP.
SO IT'S DOUBLE HUNG WINDOWS ON THE BOTTOM PAIR UPSTAIRS.
WE HAD TO PUT A SHED DORMER IN TO CREATE EGRESS WINDOWS FOR TWO BEDROOMS THAT WERE ADDED UPSTAIRS.
UM, THOSE ARE CASEMENT WINDOWS, BUT I HAD A HORIZONTAL MOUNTAIN PUT IN TO MAKE THEM LOOK LIKE ONE OVER ONE WINDOWS.
AND THEY DO HAVE A BIT OF AN INSET.
YOU CAN TELL A DIFFERENCE, UM, AS FAR AS BEING INSET VERSUS THE DOUBLE HUNGS DOWN BELOW, PARTICULARLY THE LOWER PANES OR LOWER SASHES, EXCUSE ME, OF THE DOUBLE HUNGS.
UM, DOWN BELOW, UM, IT'S BEEN A LOT OF YEARS SINCE I WAS ON THE COMMISSION, BUT I SEEM TO RECALL APPROVING VINYL WINDOWS IN ADDITIONS.
OBVIOUSLY, FIBER CEMENT SIDING AND DIFFERENT THINGS THAT CAN BE DONE THAT DON'T HAVE TO BE COMPATIBLE.
AND THIS FACES THE STREET, UM, BUT WAS APPROVED.
SO I DON'T KNOW IF IT SHOULD BE A EASY MODIFICATION TO MAKE THOSE WINDOWS APPEAR TO BE, UH, ONE OVER ONE.
I HAVE, I'VE TALKED TO ANDERSON AND THERE'S A KIT FOR THAT TO THE MIC.
I'VE TALKED TO ANDERSON, AND YES, THEY DO OFFER THAT KIT.
IN THE MEANTIME, I BOUGHT SOME, UM, SOME STRIPS, UH, ONE INCH STRIPS, WHICH IS THE SAME WIDTH OF THE, UH, DOUBLE HUNG UP FRONT.
I HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING WITH THEM, BUT, UH, I WAS GOING DOWN THAT PATH AS A, AS AN ALTERNATIVE SOLUTION.
BUT YES, I MEAN, WE'RE THINKING ALIKE.
AND I CAN SYMPATHIZE WITH COST OVERRUNS AND I'M SURE, 'CAUSE ANY OF THESE OLD BUILDINGS, THESE OLD HOMES, UH, YOU, YOU JUST
SO I, I DON'T, THIS MIGHT ELIMINATE ONE OF THE OBJECTIONS OF ONE LIGHT CASEMENT WINDOWS BY GIVING THEM A ONE OVER ONE APPEARANCE.
[00:45:01]
FEEL LIKE WHEN I READ THE TRANSCRIPT, THEY HAD DISCUSSED THAT POSSIBILITY THAT IT WASN'T, DIDN'T MAKE INTO THE C OF R.DO YOU, DO YOU KNOW ANYTHING MORE ABOUT WHY THAT WAS? 'CAUSE IT, I AGREE WITH COMMISSIONER HELLIER.
I MEAN, AND TO ME, AGAIN, THE ISSUE IS VISUAL COMPATIBILITY.
IT DOESN'T HAVE TO PHYSICALLY OPERATE, IT HAS TO BE VISUALLY COMPATIBLE.
I DO REMEMBER THAT IT CAME UP AT VERY BRIEFLY.
UM, TAYLOR, DO YOU RECALL READING ANYTHING ABOUT, UH, THE, THE TRANSCRIPT, AN OFFICIAL UNOFFICIAL TRANSCRIPTS IN YOUR REPORT? AND, UM, I JUST CAN'T RECALL WHETHER THERE, IT, WE WOULD HAVE TO LOOK FOR IT, BUT I, I KNOW IT WAS MENTIONED, AND I DON'T KNOW IF THE WHOLE NUMBER MENTIONS, BUT THERE WAS A MENTION, UH, A THOUGHT OF THE IDEA OF DOING SOMETHING.
I DON'T THINK IT WAS BROUGHT UP.
YOU DON'T RECALL THAT? WELL, I'D HAVE TO GO BACK THROUGH THE VIDEO.
IT'S, IT'S NEITHER HERE NOR THERE.
I JUST DIDN'T WANT TO DO ANYTHING THAT HAD ALREADY BEEN THOROUGHLY CONSIDERED AND REJECTED BY SOMEONE FOR ONE REASON OR ANOTHER WHO WAS DEFINITELY NOT THOROUGHLY CONSIDERED.
OTHERWISE EVERYBODY WOULD REMEMBER.
UH, THIS IS COMMISSIONER BEDMINSTER VIRTUAL.
UH, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I LIKE ABOUT THE DISCUSSION RIGHT NOW, HAVING TO BE THE LY COMPATIBLE HAS TO DO WITH JUST MAKING EVERYTHING LOOK FROM A GLANCE AS BEING THE SAME.
THE OTHER THING THAT STICKS WITH ME HAVING TO DO WITH WHERE THE NEW CONSTRUCTION IS VERSUS THE OLD CONSTRUCTION, TO ME THERE IS A COMPATIBILITY AS FAR AS HAVING ALL THE WINDOWS THE SAME IN THE NEW CONSTRUCTION AREA.
AND SO THIS IS WHERE I'M HAVING DIFFICULTY WANTING TO FORM, YOU KNOW, MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE CONFORMING WITH THE ORDINANCE VERSUS OTHER, THIS OTHER PART OF THE ORDINANCE THAT SAYS, YOU KNOW, AS FAR AS DISTINGUISHING BETWEEN THE OLD AND THE NEW, UM, I REALLY NEEDING SOME GUIDANCE FROM MY FELLOW COMMISSIONERS HERE AS FAR AS WHICH WAY TO GO.
BUT THERE SEEMS TO BE SOME, UM, LET'S SAY COMPATIBILITY WITH HAVING THE WINDOWS DURING THE NEW CONSTRUCTION BEING SIMILAR AND THE, UH, OBVIOUSLY THE WINDOWS THAT'S IN THE OLD CONSTRUCTION THAT, UH, PREVIOUS, THEY'RE ALL THE SAME WITH THE ADDITION OF THE A MUTTON OR SOMETHING THAT WOULD MAKE THE VISUAL ISSUE, UH, LOOK LIKE A ONE OVER ONE.
I CAN CERTAINLY GET ON BOARD WITH THAT, BUT I'M REALLY WANTING TO HEAR PARTICULARLY, UH, UH, FOR YOU COMMISSIONER ELLIOT AND, AND OTHER THINGS THAT YOU HAVE TO OFFER TO THIS DISCUSSION TODAY.
UH, YEAH, IT'S, IT'S ALWAYS A, A BIG ISSUE OF HOW YOU MAKE SOMETHING AS VISUALLY COMPATIBLE, BUT, UH, VISUALLY DISTINCT.
UH, BUT, UM, AND IT COMES UP A LOT AND I, I DON'T KNOW, THAT UNFORTUNATELY IS SORT OF A, UH, PRACTICE AND SUBJECTIVITY, UH, A LITTLE BIT.
I MEAN, YOU, YOU DON'T, YOU CERTAINLY DON'T NEED TO, YOU KNOW, RECREATE HISTORIC WOODEN WINDOWS THERE.
AND I THINK OFTENTIMES JUST A, A, A GLANCE OR SOMEONE THAT KNOWS, WILL SEE THAT THEY'RE ACTUALLY DIFFERENT WINDOWS, BUT IN THE SAME STYLE.
AND WHEN WE HAVE AN ADDITION LIKE THIS, THE, THE MASSING AND THE SIDING ARE GONNA LOOK DISTINCT ENOUGH THAT THE ADDITION IS GONNA, I BELIEVE, STAND OUT AS DISTINCT.
I MEAN, JD KNOWS A LOT MORE ABOUT STYLE AND ARCHITECTURE THAN I DO, BUT THAT'S HOW I'VE ALWAYS UNDERSTOOD.
WE, WE APPLY IT, IT JUST, YOU'VE GOTTA, YOU, YOU DON'T WANT TO, UH, HAVE IT APPEAR AS THOUGH IT WAS A VERY LARGE AND UNUSUAL HOUSE BUILT IN 1930.
YOU KNOW, YOU NEED TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT, OH, OKAY, YOU CAN SEE WHERE THE ORIGINAL HOUSE IS.
HERE'S THE ADDITION, BUT IT, IT BLENDS IN NICELY, BUT IT'S CLEARLY EVERYONE KNOWS IT'S AN ADDITION.
AND I, I DON'T THINK THAT MEANS, YOU KNOW, THE, THE WINDOWS HAVE TO BE, UH, DIFFERENT, UH, IN THIS CASE.
AND THEY COULD BE VERY, VERY SIMILAR.
AND STILL, I THINK IT WOULD READ PRETTY PLAINLY AS, AS AN ADDITION, A LATER EDITION, WHICH IS, IS FINE, BUT STILL NEEDS THAT VISUAL COMPATIBILITY.
SO I, I MEAN, THAT I THINK IS THE REMAINING ISSUE.
AND I BELIEVE WHAT THE HHC TRIED TO DO WAS COMPROMISE, BECAUSE SOME WINDOWS ARE FURTHER AWAY, BUT STILL VISIBLE FROM THE STREET.
THEY DECIDED THAT RECESSING THEM OR PUTTING TRIM AROUND THEM WOULD MAKE THOSE VISUALLY COMPATIBLE OR SAVE SOME MONEY.
BUT THE OTHER ONES WERE SO CLOSE, THEY NEEDED TO HAVE A LOT MORE VISUAL COMPATIBILITY.
THAT'S WHAT I THINK IS MAYBE THE, THE PROBLEM WITH THE DECISION.
UH, SO I THINK WE'RE GETTING SOMEWHERE.
I, I WANNA SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THE, YOU KNOW, THE DISCUSSION ABOUT THE VIEW FROM THE ALLEY VERSUS VIEW FROM THE STREET.
[00:50:01]
BEEN UTILIZED ON THE GARAGE APARTMENT, AND THAT'S WHY THE WINDOWS HAVE BEEN, WOULD BE APPROVABLE ON THAT GARAGE APARTMENT AS CASEMENTS THAT, BECAUSE THAT BUILDING'S PRIMARY FACE IS THE ALLEY AND IT'S A SECONDARY BUILDING, THE QUESTION WOULD BE THAT THE PRIMARY RESIDENCE HAS AN ALLEY SIDE, BUT ANY OTHER HOUSE THAT DOESN'T HAVE AN ALLEY HAS THE, HAS ALL, THEY ALL HAVE THE SAME CODE REVIEW IN THE ORDINANCE THAT THE SIDES VISIBLE FROM THE STREET ARE REGULATED BY THE ORDINANCE.SO THIS ONE, ANYTHING FROM THE STREET IS STILL REGULATED BY THE ORDINANCE.
THE ADVANTAGE OF THAT STATEMENT ABOUT THE ALLEY, I FEEL IS WHAT'S GIVING YOU AN ADVANTAGE ON THE GARAGE APARTMENT, UH, THAT WAS IN THE BACK.
I, I PERSONALLY FEEL LIKE I'M READY TO MAKE A MOTION.
I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S, UM, IT'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT BECAUSE IT'S A LITTLE AWKWARD BECAUSE THIS IS NOT WHAT THE APPLICANT ORIGINALLY HAS ASKED FOR IN THE APPEAL.
BUT BASED ON WHAT YOU'RE, YOU'VE TOLD US, I, I HOPE THIS IS ACCEPTABLE, IS THAT, UH, I WOULD MOVE THAT WE, UM, UH, REVERSE OR MODIFY THE HH C'S C OF R TO REQUIRE, UH, IDENTICAL, UH, TRIM AS ALREADY DONE BY THE APPLICANT ON ALL THE WINDOWS AT ISSUE, ALL THE CASEMENT WINDOWS AND ADDITIONALLY REQUIRE A, A MUTTON, UH, BE, UH, BE PLACED IN THE MIDDLE TO, UH, SOLIDIFY THE VISUAL COMPATIBILITY OF THOSE WINDOWS WITH THE EXISTING HISTORIC WINDOWS.
IS THAT CLEAR? IS THAT OKAY?
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? STATE YOUR NAME AFTER YOUR RESPONSE.
HELL, YOUR AYE THAT MR. VIRTUAL.
I SAY, AYE, THAT PASSES UNANIMOUSLY.
I DO WANNA THANK THE, UH, HOMEOWNER FOR HIS VISUAL THAT HE PROVIDED THAT WAS FAR MORE CLEAR, A VISUAL FOR THE WINDOW CONFIGURATION THAN WHAT WE WERE LOOKING AT FROM STAFF.
SO MAYBE STAFF COULD LOOK AT THAT AS AN EXAMPLE FOR HOW TO VISUALLY COMMUNICATE THAT THIS ISSUE.
UM, DO WE HAVE ANY OTHER COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC? UM, HEARING NONE, I AM ADJOURNING THIS MEETING OF THE HOUSTON PRESERVATION APPEALS BOARD.
I
PLEASE DISCONNECT ALL DEVICES AND THE RECORDING HAS BEEN STOPPED.